My life, my blog, and B-school somewhere inbetween

Inside Scoop

2006-10-22T22:25:00.000-04:00

Yes, I have returned. It has been much longer than I thought, but that's what b-school will do to you! To all those loyal readers who still have me on RSS-feed as well as to all those who forgot to take me off, let it be known that I will blog again. I completely understand how all the bloggers of legendary status stopped blogging. As an applicant it seemed unfathomable, but as a student I can't understand how people have time to even write a blog! So, yes, b-school is as busy as people say it is. I have managed to find time now because I'm procrastinating. But, I'm sure you'd rather hear about something else...

So, what is Kellogg really like? The answer- pretty much awesome. I know, everyone who goes to b-school says it's awesome. But every b-school is not. I have yet to meet anyone at Kellogg who is not thrilled with their experience thus far (including 2nd years). On the other hand, I have heard about significant others at other b-schools who are less than satisfied. I am fairly confident I could not have gone to a more fun b-school.

The Good

1) KWEST. KWEST is amazing. You go on a trip with 20-25 other of your fellow students (5 of them are 2nd year trip leaders) to some crazy location, and then you basically just party with them. No discussion of hometown, work experience, or b-school is allowed. You're just there to meet some people on a real level. The people in your KWEST trip become some of your tightest friends at Kellogg. We hang out all the time too. Out of the 20-25 people, I'd say I'll probably keep in touch with 3/4 of them for the rest of my life, and at least 1/2 of them I'll be tight with for a long time to come. That's how close you get. And then aside from the people, it's just a hell of a lot of fun! Activities by day, parties by night, it just never stops. Every year there's one "mystery trip" where the students have no idea where it's going- top secret. This year the mystery trip was to Dubai. No joke. How awesome is that?!

2) CIM. CIM is Kellogg's orientation program. We don't do any of that trip to the woods to bond stuff. It's basically just half a week of getting to know everyone in your section through activities like cheering competitions, talent shows, olympics, scav hunts, etc., then another half to full week of actual orientation stuff like how does the career center work, how do I add/drop classes, etc., and then you take your first class with your section for the rest of CIM. The class is on Leading Organizations. Pretty good class depending on the teacher.

3) People. The people here at Kellogg are really cool. Of course there's the typical "OMG, all my classmates have done such amazing things before they came here" stuff, but aside from that the people are genuinely people I'd want to hang out with. There's always talk of the kid in b-school that everyone is like "How the f- did that kid get in? He's so annoying and says such stupid comments in class. He's such a suck-up. Everyone hates him." In Kellogg, I have yet to see anyone even close to that. No one is pompous. People are not super competitive. Hell, people aren't even really competitive at all (in class)! No one has been like "Well I worked at GOLDMAN SACHS" or anything like it. I have yet to even be asked what my GMAT was! People are just nice here. They would much rather help someone out than win. I've never seen so many people volunteer to help in various circumstances before. Sure, there are a few people here I don't like, but they're not so bad that I dislike them. I don't mind if they're around, but I wouldn't make an effort to hang out with them. Honestly, I can only think of maybe five people like that though. And I've met at least 100. Maybe it's just a one-time thing with my class, but I doubt it. B-school matriculation is a self-selecting process. Cool people are just naturally drawn to Kellogg...

4) Ski Trip. There's a ski trip evey year the week after finals in December. We're going to Vail. 700 people are going. Sponsorship. VIP front row passes to the Counting Crows concert. Less than $1000 including airfare for the week with 4 days of lift tickets and lots of free booze at the sponsored parties every day and night. We're staying in condo-suites with no more than 2 to a room. It's ridiculous. I know. That's just how we roll.

5) Parties. It feels like everyone hangs out. Tuesday night and the weekend are huge. There are so many theme-parties to go to. They even get sponsored by the school. We hang out in Evanston a lot, but I've been down to Chicago like two out of every three weeks since I've been here. Great times.

6) Recruiting. Recruiting at this school is pretty easy. People are not super competitive, so you don't need to be elbowing anyone to get into a circle to talk to a company rep. All the big employers come to campus. The job market is great so there's no issue in terms of getting a job. You go to Kellogg- they just assume you're more personable than the rest. If you can demonstrate some quant, you are like a superstar. It's very easy to stand out here in the Finance industry if you have some experience. Very few do.

7) Northwestern University. It's such a beautiful campus when it's nice out, I can't begin to tell you. And Evanston is not your typical suburb. It's got all the stuff you'd want in a suburb (lots of green), but it has a "downtown" area where most Kellogg students live which has the stores you want (Panera, Chipotle, Borders, Cinema, Urban Outfitters, etc.) and high-rise apartment buildings you might prefer to live in. And Chicago is only 30 minutes away...

7) I could go on, but I don't need to.

The Bad

1) CIM. CIM is great, but there are bad parts to it. All the events and stuff make you feel like you're in summer camp. Kind of lame, but everyone is doing it so you all kind of just shrug it off and talk about it over a beer that night. The worst part of CIM though is that they pack in way too much. The first weekend we only had Sunday off. The second weekend we had no day off. Too much. It would've been better if they just started earlier and didn't try to cram so much in. Since this is Kellogg, if the students complain they have the ability to change it for next year. We'll see what happens...

2) Technology. Our technology sucks. Plain and simple. The hardest part of b-school is coordinating people's schedules because everyone is busy with different activities, but there's always a group project to work on for class. We do not have an Outlook exchange server, thus we can't schedule a meeting looking at everyone's availability. It's a giant pain in the ass. There are these excel sheets people send around that group members fill in to see when will work. Lame. We have to use an entirely different program that has mediocre interface to book a room too. Very annoying.

3) Incest. You pretty much only hang out with your fellow Kellogg students. It's very incestuous. I'm sure it's going to bother me by winter or spring quarter. Probably like this at every b-school though...

4) Cold. It's cold. Enough said.

5) Recruiting. Sure, it's easy to get a job. But this school is known for Marketing, Consulting, and Brand Management. Finance, not so much. Not every bank comes here for all their divisions. It would be nice if they did, but I guess the fact that I only have 20-30 kids to compete against instead of 100 makes up for it. I'm told it's not a big deal to reach out to an Alumnus at a bank and ask for some help getting access to their recruiting though. I'll let you know how that goes. Anyway, what is lacking though is training. There are interview prep classes offered by the banking club, but they only have one on a given topic and they kind of occur over an extended period of time. It's not talked about all the time the way it is at the GSB. I'm ok because I know a lot about company presentation etiquette from my friends at the GSB, but if I didn't it would not be good. GSB has this stuff down to a science. Kellogg kids are lost to a good extent on this one. We're not all about that kind of competition.

M-B-What?

2006-06-03T07:09:00.000-04:00

Been a while, thought I'd drop in on the MBA blogging community. Travels and all, you know. No time to sit for hours at a computer. And I'm not good like MBAJ or Marina who'd put up a whole bunch of pictures and talk all about their trips, etc. Sorry. Anyway, thought I'd mention that in the last 6 weeks that I've been traveling, I've only met one person who'd even heard of an MBA. And I've met a LOT of people. Granted, most are backpackers who basically just work for a couple years in random jobs to save for traveling, but still, I thought they might have heard of it like back home. The one guy who did know of it worked in the finance department of a telecom, and I was trying to sell him on the merits of the MBA for what he wanted to do after traveling. He, and just about everyone else, just couldn't get over the cost. Everyone I've met can't fathom paying $120,000 for four years tuition for undergrad, let alone and additional $120K for an MBA! Nobody pays for undergrad in Europe, it seems. Or if they do it's a couple thousand. A bunch of these people take out like $10K in loans so they can go traveling. And that's all the debt they have. Why can't we have this kind of system?

Where are you?

2006-05-10T04:34:00.000-04:00

So, I've been traveling now for like two weeks and have been to four places so far, and I have yet to meet ANY backpackers even remotely related to business or b-school. I met one guy in Auckland who was staying at the hostel as part of a holiday when he came to New Zealand for business, but that's it! Come on people, if you're already in, what are you doing now? Get out there are see the world! I've only met like five Americans total, and they were all college aged. There are SO many Brits and Germans. I guess we Americans have got to get out more...

Oh, and to the person who asked, I booked KWEST when I was in New Zealand. Convenient because it was 5pm there when it was midnight in Chicago :).

MIA

2006-04-30T06:28:00.000-04:00

I've been MIA lately. I know. And it looks like I'll be MIA for a while. To summarize, I quit my job, moved out of my apartment, and am now backpacking around the world. Only been at it a couple days, but it's been awesome. I highly recommend to anyone considering doing something like it before school starts. I'll be traveling for about 3.5 months, and compared to the other travelers I've met along the way, that's really short! Anyway, I'll post about b-school stuff as it comes up during my travels, but basically there will not be a whole lot going up on the blog for a while. I fully intend to blog the real deal at Kellogg this fall though, so don't worry, Redwolf is not leaving you. This is not "goodbye", but "til we meet again".

Re: Anonymous

2006-04-12T12:20:00.000-04:00

In response to my last post, the Anonymous poster which offended MBA Jackass so much (I think it's him) left this comment-

Since you made some sense in your last paragraph, I will NOT say "Have fun at your cult." It's always important to think for yourself.

And for what down to earth people (and you made note of this) think of the spaghetti sticks and marshmallows read "Year One" by Robert Reid. I'm paraphrasing here, but once the protagonist learns that he has to do something like that at HBS, he says "I'm tired of this Northwestern crap." I thought that was pretty funny.

Well, Anonymous, if I still cared what people had to say about me I might say something like "thanks for not labeling me a cultist", but, sorry, I don't, so I won't. I will comment on your belief in thinking for oneself though because I think it is a relavant topic. My undergraduate education was founded on this principle in comination with questioning all of one's assumptions and preconceived notions. That will always be a part of my thought process. And while I do believe most people do not know how to do this and are easily influenced, just because Kellogg has a very strong sense of "school spirit" does not logically mean students do not think for themselves. It might very well be the case that the school is so good that the overwhelming majority of the people really like it. My experiences there and hanging out with future classmates have not contradicted this possibility. And I did meet a 1st year who was not so "rah rah" at DAK. He wasn't into the "party" scene so much, but he still liked the school and didn't seem to dislike the people. Upon entry to DAK I did think the first years were a bit nutty with their passion for the school. I was expecting this as I had heard so much about it beforehand. While it was weird to have this passion thrust upon me before I had actually experienced what all the hype was about, by the end of DAK I did not think them so nutty anymore. They were just having a really good time at Kellogg and wanted to share it with others. These "sharing" and "really friendly" things were just foreign to my New York lifestyle ;-).

But, while I would not characterize the atmosphere as "cultish" yet, I have not completely ruled out this possibility either. I have not gone through enough of the academics to draw any strong conclusions. B-school socialization in general is not typically intellectual, so to draw conclusions about our topic solely from this area of the Kellogg experience would be shortsighted. The classroom is where I would expect to find individual thinking. Kellogg's focus on teamwork and collaboration might hinder this and create "one mind", and if it does then the school will get a "re-education facility" label from me. So, the possibility is out there, but, Anonymous, I'm pretty sure you do not have enough evidence to justify such a claim. I would suggest you "think" a bit more before you speak.

And on your last comment, if I were to believe in the stereotypes of arrogance and egotism at HBS, should I be surprised that the HBS student thought building a tower out of spaghetti and marshmallows was "stupid" or "beneath him" or "Northwestern"? I enjoyed it as a problem solving exercise and the opportunity to try to construct something (I liked playing with Legos a lot as a kid). It is the narrow minded thinker who does not give something different a fair chance...

Oh, and how you could label Kellogg people "cultish" and HBS people "down to earth" on a relative scale is beyond me.

Comments?

DAK- The Long Version

2006-04-08T20:54:00.000-04:00

Ok, a week has past since DAK. The grieving process is nearly over and I think I'm ready to talk about it. I've come to terms with the whole situation and am willing to accept it. DAK is over. I have to go back to my ordinary life until August. Sigh.

DAK was awesome. From start to finish, I had nothing but a good time. Met some really cool people, got all my questions on Kellogg answered, and even took care of housing for the next two years! Here's a not so brief rundown of events-

Thursday

Arrive around 2:30pm. Call one of the Evanston cabbies for a flat rate lift from the airport to Evanston. Once we cross the border into Evanston, his meter mysteriously turns on. I'm like, "WTF?" He says something in broken english about this being "his business", to which I reply, "it's a flat rate, $28 is all I'm paying." About five minutes later he pushes a button and the meter turns off. When he drops me off, he says something like, "The meter went on by accident. It must have gone on when I was calling in about another fare. You understand, right?" Yeah, I understood you tried to rip me off, dipshit. But I digress. I had just arrived at the lovely McManus house, Kellogg's dorm. I was staying with a student host, but I had no idea it was at the dorm. I call my host to let him know I'm there and to let me in, but he doesn't pick up. Uh oh. Combined with the cab incident, this is not the way I wanted the weekend to start out.

Eventually I get in touch with him, blah, blah, shows me around, etc. He says something like, "People always talk shit about McManus being a dorm, but it's really not. It's an apartment building." Yeah... it's a dorm. My dorm in undergrad had a living (common) room with a kitchen and a bedroom or two attached to it. That's all McManus was. When the chairs are those ones with the red or blue fabric and the wooden arms that go all the way around to connect to the legs, it's a dorm. So, I knew I was definitely not going to live in McManus.

After the meet and greet with the host, met a bunch of 2nd years who were making their soon to be vacated apartments available for showing. Saw three of them, then met my college buddy in Wicker Park for dinner and drinks. Good times. Got back around midnight and learned that I should budget 45-60 minutes if I want to take the purple line to downtown, door-to-door.

Friday

Got up in time to get the last scraps of breakfast at DAK. Followed my "section" into the auditorium for the obligatory 1 hour welcome. Not bad. The director of admissions got up and read little one-line snippets from around 40-50 applicants' essays to tell us about "who are classmates are." I was a bit surprised when I heard a line that sounded vaguely familiar... After all that, went to an icebreaker thing with our section where we had to learn about four people sitting next to us. Whatever. Typical b-school crap. Anyway, it was good to at least meet a bunch of people and hear about the different types of backgrounds we had. After this, we had some more auditorium shit. Topic: Academics. I didn't care. Instead, I ditched to go meet up with this guy my buddy at the GSB knew from his summer associate class at XYZ bank and talk to him about Sales and Trading recruiting at Kellogg. As you all know, Kellogg is not known for its finance program the way Chicago or Wharton are. So, recruiting was obviously a concern for me. If I wanted to be an I-banker, I knew it would be fine. Kellogg has plenty of that. But S&T is another story. I had heard mixed things, so I wanted to hear it from someone who actually went through it. Long story short, he dismissed all my concerns and, as an added bonus, basically told me that with my background I would easily stand out amongst everyone else. After I told my buddy at the GSB all the details, he was like "Dude, go there." So, it was around that moment I for the most part decided to go to Kellogg. But I was cautious enough to hold off until after I saw some of the partying I had heard so much about.

Next had a lunch with professors talking about a specific track- finance, consulting, marketing, etc. and the relevant coursework and academics. Then we had the next section teambuilding exercise where we split up and built towers out of spaghetti sticks and marshmallows. Much harder than you'd think. I learned that my team worked better when there was no clear leadership and delegation of roles. The first time around we all had a general idea of what we were trying to do and so people just did the parts they saw needed work. The second time when we delegated, things were not as smooth and more chaotic. Atypical b-school lesson. I realized that the people involved needed to be fairly smart in order for the first method to work under such time pressure, so at least I felt more confident about my future classmates. Then we had a mini-class, which was about 1 hr with two professors doing an example of what a class at Kellogg is like. Probably had their best profs out for this part, and it showed. Classes were fun and interesting (I know, crazy right?). Then I ditched the next thing to take a nap. Breakfast was early and I went to bed late. Redwolf does not function well without sleep. Got about 30 min of rest in, and went down to "TG". TG is Kellogg's Friday drinkfest in the main building. Lasts about an hour or two, they have kegs and some good bottled beer, and it's free! GSB has something similar called "Liquidity Preference". I'm sure all the b-schools do. They also had the KWEST fair then, so I got to learn about the different weeklong trips incoming Kellogg students can go on the week before they start. There are some really cool destinations. Talked to some people I knew from NY, then went with a new section to have dinner at a local Evanston restaurant. We went to one of the bars. Food... not so good. But, it had the advantage of being the bar where everyone was going to meet up later. I had a great time at dinner, talked a lot with one of the "JVs" (significant others of Kellogg students), and got the lowdown from her and this 1st year chick on the dating seen and my chances. Good stuff ;-). After dinner we mosied on over to the bar area and I found myself sitting at a table with two 1st year guys. In the span of the next 20 minutes, five hot 1st year girls came over. Yes five girls at random (more or less), and I do mean hot (as a single guy this is very important ladies; apologies if I sound crass). I was impressed. At that point I was really convinced I'd be going to Kellogg :-).

Saturday

Decided that after the previous night I would skip whatever was planned for the morning. Got up around 11am, made it just in time for lunch with students talking about recruiting. Basically heard the same stuff as the guy I talked with Friday said, so I felt even more confident. It was good to hear it from a 1st year as well. I heard that the first DAK didn't do such a good job on this front so I extra scrutinous. Then we got corralled again into the auditorium for the alumni discussion panel. Noticed there were a lot less people than on Friday. I kind of snoozed through this panel, and then left to make some phone calls about an apartment and came back in time for the next presentation on the "Kellogg Experience". It basically just talked about some of the clubs and unique things like GIM. Honestly, I don't remember all that much about it because I kept leaving to call the guy about the apartment. There were some issues with someone else who had signed a lease, but then was thinking about backing out, etc., so a bunch of calls needed to be made. By the time I was done with that the presentations were over and it was now time to go to the club fair. Got to speak with the reps from all the clubs on campus, figured out which I was likely to join, and shortly thereafter went back to McManus with an hour to spare before the closing dinner and night out.

Closing dinner was at the Museum of Science and Industry. It was fairly nice. Food was ok, drinks were not free. Then we got on a bus to go to Zellas, a club/lounge downtown. The bus driver decided to take the most ridiculously long way I've ever seen to get there, going west then east then west then east, so while we were amongst the first to leave I think we were amongst the last to arrive. Anyway, Zellas was a good time. I met up with another buddy from the GSB who was hanging out with his Kellogg friends he knew from undergrad, threw back a bunch of shots, had an awesome time, found myself calling it a night around 1:30am. But, I desperately needed food so I went to Dunkin Donuts and therefore missed the bus. Buses left every 30 min, so no biggy. Went back inside, 2:10am rolled around and no announcement had come about the 2:00am bus. I figured it was safer to just get on the bus then since 2:30am was the last bus back. A few people got on the bus, but 2:30am came and went with no announcement, leaving many many behind. Oh well, sucks for them.

Again, I had a retarded bus driver so it was 4:30am when we got back (with the time change that night). Checked my email because I had to fill out an application for the apartment and email it back to the landlord so we could have a lease ready by Sunday. In the email he said "we should meet at 11am". It was 5am. I was piss drunk. Fuck me.

Sunday

Somehow I woke up at 11am. No alarm, just instinct (if you knew Redwolf you'd be really surprised about this). I felt pretty ill, but got myself together and talked to the guy and said we'd meet at noon. Went to get some breakfast, saw some really attractive undergrads, went to my new home, signed a lease, and knew at that moment I was definitely going to Kellogg ;-). Went to the airport, got on a standby flight home before the big storm really hit, and made it home by 7pm. It was a great way to end a really great weekend.

Epilogue

As you all know, I am going to Kellogg in the fall. DAK sold me. People kept asking me during DAK if I had "drank the koolaid". Um... no? While I am sold on Kellogg, I don't think I'm going to end up being one of these "Rah Rah" Kellogg types. And while I think Kellogg is going to be awesome, I don't think it's going to be quite like an acid trip. Instead, how about we just say, "I'm on the bus."

Oh, and a special thanks to Clear Admit for the nomination. Much appreciated.

Rumble in the Windy City

2006-04-04T15:38:00.000-04:00

...continued from the previous post

(whistle blows)

Announcer: And so it begins Ladies and Gentlemen. The storied fight for Redwolf056's favor is now underway. Right now our two opponents are sizing each other up, but it looks like the GSB is getting ready to make the first blow...

GSB: Kellogg man, I don't even know why you're here. You know you're gonna lose. You don't have the finance recruiting to compete with me, chump!

(GSB pushes Kellogg)

Kellogg: Hey, hey, watch who you're shoving there home-boy. You almost wrinkled my sweater-vest. Do you have any idea what the boys at the club would say if I came with a wrinkled sweater? And we do to have the finance recruiting to compete. Most of the banks that come to your campus come to ours as well. The difference is we don't have nearly so many students trying to grab their attention. They can sit back and chat in a civilized manner. Redwolf056 will be much better off with us because it will be much easier for him to stand out.

GSB: Man, Redwolf056 will stand out wherever he's at. He's going to come with us because he knows he'll be best off at the place with the most firms coming to recruit- and that's us! We got alumni throughout the industry for him to use.

Kellogg: You may have more of them, but we make up for it with quality. Our alumni will go out of their way to hook each other up, unlike yours. Maybe if you guys actually had a fun environment over there they'd be happier to help each other out.

GSB: Oh, we have plenty of fun over here. We may not be a "party" school like you, but we've improved a lot in the last couple years.

Kellogg: Didn't "Fun come to die" at your campus?

Shouts from the audience: Oh damn, he did not just go there! Kellogg just said your momma's a ho' and cheated on yo' daddy with Fun. You gonna take that?!

(Kellogg and GSB turn toward the audience with confused looks on their faces, then shrugs their shoulders)

GSB: Why you gotta bring that up?! That was a long time ago man. Things are different. Fun, Jr. has been coming by over the last couple years now. He doesn't blame us for his what happened to his Dad. It was an accident!

Kellogg: "Coming by"? At our campus Fun, Jr. converted his father's mansion into a full fledged resort! He spends all his weekends with us.

GSB: Whatever man, we have plenty of fun over here. Besides, b-school is only partly about fun. It's about learning too. And we have the best academics of any program in the country for finance. I bet you guys don't even know what a Vasicek model is.

Kellogg: Uh... I think I was hungover that day in class. But our finance department is really good. We may not have all those "quant" classes you have, but you obviously don't know Redwolf056. He already has a strong quant background. He doesn't need any more. If anything, he's got to counterbalance that image with other stuff like teamwork and social skills. And WE are the best school for that.

GSB: Teamwork is for chumps! All it does is slow you down.

Kellogg: (Gasps) You dare insult teamwork? You have crossed the line GSB!

GSB: Bring it, bitch.

Shouts from the audience: About time you punk asses actually do something and stop pussyfooting around. Knock the bitch out!

(Kellogg and GSB move in to try to hit each other)

Announcer: Ladies and Gentlemen this could be it. The first real blows of the match. Here it comes... Oh!! Unbelievable! Kellogg and GSB punched each other at the same time and they are both down for the count!

Shouts from the audience: You call that a punch? Looked more like a bitch-slap to me.

Announcer: These two champs seem to be really out of it. Ten seconds have passed, so the first one to actually stand up will be declared the winner... What's this? Chicago appears to be moving. He appears to have turned himself over and is trying to pick himself up. Oh, but wait! Kellogg has started moaning. He appears to be trying to say something, but I can't quite make it out. Yes, it's starting to sound clearer. I think I can almost understand it. It sounds, hmm, I think it sounds like....

Kellogg: Team! Help me up!

(Kellogg's team runs over and picks him up)

Referee: (blows whistle) That's it! Kellogg is the winner!

Announcer: Oh my god, another unprecedented event, Ladies and Gentlemen! Kellogg has just won by using his team for support. Anything goes in a streetfight like this, and it appears teamwork has come through for Kellogg to win. This is a great day for all the Kellogg fans out there. It looks like Redwolf056 will be attending Kellogg in the fall...

(audience cheers)

Let's Get Ready to Rumble!

2006-03-25T15:46:00.000-05:00

Studio Host: Hello folks, welcome to Chicago's beautiful Magnificant Mile and boy do we have a fight for you. It has been the talk of the town for weeks now, but tonight will be the night we find out the fate of one of the veteran bloggers of the business school applicant community, Redwolf056. And how fitting it is that the fight will be a grudge match between two of the midwest's fiercest rivals- the University of Chicago GSB and Northwestern University's Kellogg School of Management. Here's what Kellogg had to say earlier today...

(cut to interview clip)

Kellogg: It's gonna be a great fight tonight, no doubt about it. I have a lot of respect for the GSB. It's got a lot of smart people over there. But, you know, I think this fight is going to come down to the social aspects - having fun and that kind of stuff - and we've got the GSB beat on that front.

Interviewer: So you think you're going to win?

Kellogg: Well, I'm not exactly sure about that yet. I have to consult my team first. Hey, team? Team? What does everyone think about my chances of winning? Can we come to a consensus on this one?

(cut back to studio)

Host: Interesting thoughts. And here's what the GSB had to say earlier...

(cut to interview clip)

GSB: Oh yeah, I'm going to win this fight. No problem. I got the academics and the finance rep. You know, Kellogg is one of the nicest and coolest dudes I know, but it won't be able to hold up in a street fight. I may be from Wall Street, but when you live in the ghetto you're bound to pick up a few things. I ran a spreadsheet model with multifactor monte carlo simulations and calculated my probability of winning at 62%. The numbers don't lie man.

Interviewer: You seem pretty confident, but where's your trainer and the rest of your team?

GSB: Oh, them? Yeah, the last two got shot as we were mugged leaving campus for the fight, but most got taken out during the recruiting season last quarter. One of the career changers couldn't take the competition and went postal. You know how it is.

(cut back to studio)

Host: There you have it folks. Two great contenders vying for the love of one great blogger. Let's take you down street-side for the start of the fight.

(cut to street)

Announcer: Ladies and Gentlemen, allow me to introduce our competitors tonight. On the north side of the street, weighing in at 555 students, hailing from the beautiful suburb of Evanston, the pride of every team, the one, the only, Kellogg!!!

(applause)

Announcer: And on the south side of the street, weighing in at 550 students, hailing from the mean streets of Hyde Park, the master of matlab, the one, the only, Chicago GSB!!!

(applause)

Referee: Ok boys, I want a nice clean street fight here. After I blow the whistle, I get the hell out of here and you do whatever you want to each other. No rules here. The winner will be chosen by Redwolf056, a business school applicant with a strong quantitative financial research background intending to work in fixed income markets after school. Any questions? No? Ok. When I blow this whistle come out trash talking.

(whistle blows)

to be continued...

Whoops

2006-03-16T13:06:00.000-05:00

Oh, did I mention I got dinged by Columbia? Yeah, kind of forgot about that. Doesn't really matter, I knew my app sucked, probably wouldn't have gone there anyway. I need to get out of the city for a couple years. It was kind of weird though when I was checking out my status change. Normally there's a sense of nervousness and anticipation. For Columbia, nothing. I guess I really didn't want to go there? Of course, everything's different when you got other schools to choose from... Good luck to those getting decisions in the next couple of weeks!

Things are looking good. A little too good...

2006-03-09T16:16:00.000-05:00

Had the old CBS interview. Haven't had a chance to do a writeup til now. But as I sit here and think about how it went, I'm not sure a writeup would even be helpful to my fellow applicants. See, I had a fairly unusual interview. Turns out I used to play with my interviewer's sister when we were like 3 or 4 years old (he's about 5 years older than me). So, the guy was sort of like, "I know your family, this should be a pretty simple interview." And it was. We more or less had a two-sided conversation. Originally we were supposed to do it over a beer, which would have been even more fitting, but meetings and time constraints caused it to be an in-the-office deal. Anyway, the interview started out more like me interviewing him, which was kind of weird. And then I eventually got to start talking about myself, hit every major point, took about an hour all in all, and I gotta say it was actually a pleasure to do the interview. Just because of the completely informal design and the guy kind of lauded me the whole way through (yes, lauded me). I must say also, his style has a bit of genius to it because not only did he manage to make me feel so comfortable that I was able to give a full detailed account of who I am, he also managed to very subtley ask the right questions to get the few specifics he needed which I hadn't discussed. He really knew how to direct the conversation without interupting the flow. Throughout the whole thing he kept reassuring me by interjecting how something I've done is really important to the evaluation because it shows XYZ about me. I was most impressed when he kind of stopped me and was like, "wait a minute, is it normal for someone who does [what I do- quant stuff] to also manage the development of a resulting product from start to finish and deal with clients?" The answer (at my company at least) is "no", but he was the only person I've ever met who appreciated that I was capable of doing those two very different things. I'm generally modest about these things, but once in a while it's really nice to get some appreciation. And of course, at the end when he explicitly says "Columbia needs more people like you", you know Redwolf is feeling pretty good about himself ;-). As we were walking out, he elaborates that he felt he didn't need to ask me a lot of questions because he could "just tell" based on how I spoke on the phone and what was on my resume. So I guess I was destined to succeed? Too bad my actual application sucks. Oh, and it was only when we get to the street corner where we were to part ways that I even said, "so how's your sister anyway?"

Apparently I Don't Suck

2006-03-02T12:56:00.000-05:00

So, just wanted to let you know I got into Kellogg. This is actual confirmation I am b-school worthy. I've always felt like I had this atypical advantage getting into Chicago GSB for reasons I have chosen not to elaborate upon, but getting into Kellogg is confirmation that there actually is something to the ol' Redwolf. Now I'm in the fortunate position of actually having to choose between schools. It hasn't really set in yet because I think I'm still envying myself :-). How the hell did I get so lucky? Anyway, thanks to all of you who've supported me throughout this process.

I still have yet to interview with Columbia and haven't gotten an invite for Stanford (yet), so this "applicant" thing is still not quite over. It's only a matter of time though. I'd also like to give a shout out to BrotherJimmy who has been facing the decision I am now fortunate to be facing of choosing between the GSB and Kellogg. We've been discussing the pros and cons of each given our similar short term career goals, and he's illuminated aspects of both schools I hadn't fully considered. Basically, he's made it harder for me :-). Anyway, I'll be attending DAK II and will hopefully get some straight answers to the questions that remain. I'll let you know how it goes!

Good luck to all still waiting for decisions!

Sigh

2006-02-23T18:18:00.000-05:00

So I had an interview today. No, not with a b-school, but with a kid interested in filling a junior slot within my group. He wants to go to business school eventually, and after I mentioned I was intending to go this fall he had an array of questions for me. I gave him the best advice I could give him- don't go if you just want to learn; go because you want to get a job in a different field you can't easily get from your current job and because you need to build your network. That's b-school's greatest value imo- the "start over" card. If your career is going well, don't bother with b-school. Only go because you've come to a point where you can't advance or can't advance at the pace you'd like to without it. B-school only comes around once, so don't waste it.

So then I started to think about my own life. I've come to a point in my current profession where I can't get to the kind of job I want without taking a "stepping stone" job first. In my previous searches for jobs, the "stepping stones" have never been all that interesting. Scratch that, one was interesting, but the fund was way to small to bother. Anyway, the stepping stones available don't interest me, I'm tired and want a break, and I have no real network to speak of. So, b-school is for me. But then I started to think about what went wrong way back when (obviously, the lack of tv this week has left my mind to idle thoughts ;-) ). Man, if only I knew in college what I know now. I'd be an f-in rock star. Instead, I'm just simple little Redwolf. Hell, if I just knew at the beginning of college on-campus recruiting what I knew at the end I'd have been way way better off. I had such lofty aspirations coming out of college. And I know I have the ability to achieve them. I just had no one knowledgeable to guide me. I only really needed to know maybe five or six additional things at the beginning of on-campus recruiting and I would have been set. My plans back then did not involve ever going to b-school. In the line of work I wanted to be in, b-school was almost irrelevant. In my current position, it's the only way to get into it. Ah, how life could have been different. Instead, I'm sitting at my desk bored with my job knowing I can't leave for a couple months. Ugh. Upon graduation from b-school I should have the type of job I'm looking for. I think I'll squash much of the competition. And then I'll be exactly where I should have been when I graduated from college. Only several years behind. What a waste. Hopefully my advancement will be accelerated with all the "experience" I've gathered, but who knows. Oh well, it is what it is. Can't do anything about the past now. Luckily, adaptability is one of my best skills. Now what worries me most is that there will be something else I'll learn five years from now which I'll wish I knew "back when I was looking for jobs out of b-school" that would have made a world of difference in my life. After all, you only get to go to b-school once...

Zen

2006-02-21T11:33:00.000-05:00

This morning I realized I have achieved some sort of "zen" with the whole MBA application process. At the moment, I am awaiting a decision from Kellogg and an interview invite from Stanford. I also have to schedule my Columbia interview, which I have put off way too long. Anyway, I should be in eager anticipation of my Kellogg decision, at least. And yet, I was checking out MBAJackass' blog this morning and came across a post about Kellogg decisions and it didn't even phase me. No heart skipping, nothing. My only thought was "Eh, I'll get my decision when I get it." So I realized that I have acheived some kind of zen with this whole application process (probably has something to do with the fact that I have an admit in hand...). I once would have scoured the b-week boards for info, but now it feels like there's no point. I must admit, not having this stress is pretty nice :-). Good luck to all those still awaiting their fates. Try to remember that stressing or obsessively checking is not going to increase your chances of getting in and is really only going to hurt you.

Catch Up

2006-02-15T09:40:00.000-05:00

It's been a while since I've really blogged. That "tag" thing doesn't count. So, let's recap a little.

Kellogg Interview- I had my alumni interview with Kellogg a while back. Overall, I'd say it went ok. Nothing great, but nothing bad. After my Wharton interview experience, I figure that's all I really need. I said the things I wanted to say, but I didn't say them in the best way and I might have sounded a bit disorganized. At the end I didn't feel like I really connected with the guy, but he could just be really good at not giving any indication to his interviewees. What was really good about the interview was hearing what the guy had to say about Kellogg. Obviously he loved it, but more important was that his background is in the area of finance I'd like to go into (not i-banking). He actually works at one of the premier hedge funds on the street and when I heard that I was really impressed. Kellogg has never been considered one of the big finance schools, but man, if the alumni network can place a guy at that shop there's no reason for anyone wanting to go into finance not to consider Kellogg. So, I became somewhat enamoured with Kellogg after the interview :-).

India- I went to India shortly after the interview for about a week and a half.

Chicago Trip- Around the time of the Kellogg interview I decided I needed to go and actually visit the school to "show interest". Graham at Clear Admit told me for the Wharton interview I should do it on campus in order to demonstrate my interest in the school and all, so I figured I should do the same for Kellogg. But, I already had my interview so if I went it would just be for a visit. Fine. At Wharton they had a computer where you registered yourself just for showing up on campus which probably gets noted in your file, so I figured Kellogg would have the same deal. Wrong. The main point of the trip was to demonstrate my interest in Kellogg and desire to go there, but now they have no idea I was ever there because they have you fill out nothing! Just show up, visit a class, go to the info session, tour campus, "no, no, no names here." I guess Kellogg doesn't really care if you visit? The only nugget of useful info I didn't already know was to show up for DAK2 Wednesday night so you can go apartment hunting Thursday because a LOT of places for the fall get taken by then. Sunday is not the best option. The other reason I was going was to hopefully meet a professor who's good friends with my cousin and maybe have him drop a little note to adcom about how great I am ;-). Well, he never even responded to the email my cousin sent him so that "connection" is out the door.

So I was supposed to come back to NY on Sunday, but a little snow storm got in my way so I had to stay another day. Oh but wait, all the flights back on Monday were full by the time I called them so I couldn't get back til Tuesday! Yippie! I was staying with a friend who goes to Chicago GSB (yes, I stayed with a GSBer for the express purpose of going to visit Kellogg. Sorry to say he supported the decision), so he went to campus Monday to study while I stayed at home and did nothing. Ahhh, the joy of doing nothing. I forgot how good it is. Eventually I went a saw a movie after several hours of lounging. Got some dinner, went to bed early. Anyway, so the next day I went to campus with him because we'd have to go straight to the airport. Spent the day in the Hyde Park Center. Definitely way nicer building than Kellogg. It is practically brand new after all. Went to a class in the morning taught by one of those "in demand" professors, and while the class itself was good I realized something. It was really no different than the class I took at Kellogg (also with an "in demand" prof). The prof was an engaging speaker and taught well. The class shared their ideas. What's the difference? And then I realized all schools are like this (except maybe HBS with the whole case method thing). They have a share of "great" teachers, and then a score of average teachers. Big deal. And fame isn't an indicator of "greatness" because the skills necessary to be a genius or a brilliant researcher are not the same as those for being a brilliant teacher. And so then I started to think about what really separates a school from the rest- 1) Share of faculty that are "great" teachers, 2) Variety of classes offered, and 3) depth of knowledge obtained from a class. No one has ever quantified #1, #2 is easily observable, and #3 is semi-observable. I think this is really all the "academics" part of choosing a top b-school boils down to. Good thing I don't really care about academics ;-).

As far as social life is concerned, I didn't really observe enough to draw any conclusions on. Kellogg students seemed more enthused about their school/life than Chicago students. I was surprised to hear that 1st year Kellogg students generally stay in Evanston both residentially and weekend-socially. 2nd years go to the city for the weekends, but still live in Evanston. I can't really blame them though. It's pretty nice up there. And for all those guys out there wondering, I have to say I was a little disappointed by the "talent". Granted, I did not see a large number of girls on campus, but still. Not up to the snuff everyone always talks about. The non-Kellogg peeps did make things interesting though... But what was really surprising was that the GSB actually had a pretty decent offering. Trust me, it was not always this way. Apologies to all the ladies out there who are offended by these comments.

Columbia Update- I also got an interview invite from Columbia. I submitted my app pretty early so don't start freaking out if you haven't gotten one. Like last time, I have three alums to choose from, and like last time I'm going to get my buddy at work who's a CBS alum to get their alumni profiles so I can better choose between them. Since my app to Columbia sucked I really don't care that much about this interview. I think it's going to be a waste of time. But, we'll just have to wait and see...

So you want to know something about me, eh?

2006-02-08T11:20:00.000-05:00

I've been on vacation for the last two weeks. Got back and found I was "tagged". By more than one blogger. So here are some personal details to help all of you out there "identify" me.

Four jobs I've had in my life:
Ice Cream Scooper
Camp Counselor
Inter-Library Loan Book Puller
CFO

Four movies I can watch over and over
Office Space
Star Wars
The Fifth Element
The Big Lebowski
(these are movies I can watch over and over, not my top 4 favorites)

Four places I have lived
New York
London
Earth
Universe

Four TV shows I love to watch
Lost
Gilmore Girls
Survivor
Sopranos

Four places I have been on vacation
Hong Kong
India
Prague
Tokyo

Four of my favorite food/drinks
NY Pizza
Grilled Tuna Steak
Chana [insert style here]
Microbrews

Four websites I visit daily
Yahoo Mail
Ameritrade
NY Times
Clear Admit Blog

Four places I'd rather be right now
Hawaii
B-School
Australia
In Bed

Four bloggers I'm tagging
Me
and
You
and
Everyone We Know

Life Lesson for Would-Be Travelers

2006-01-19T15:35:00.000-05:00

If you're going to a developing country and need a Visa to get in, get to the embassy early! I've had my fair share of run-in's with the Indian Consulate in NY to know that you gotta get there 30-45 minutes early during non-peak season if you don't want to spend hours there in line. Today I went to get a Visa to go to India next week, got in around 8:45am, counter opened around 9:15am, and I left around 10am. Time spent at the counter- 2 minutes. If this had been Christmas time it would have been a nightmare. All these people kept trickling in after 9:15am, and I was thinking to myself "What were you thinking? You guys are screwed. The counter closes at 12:15am sharp, you'll never make it." Then I realized these people probably had no idea how the system worked. So, I'm doing my part now to inform the would-be travelers here. Bureaucracy sucks, if you didn't realize.

In other news, that buddy of mine who got into Wharton got dinged by HBS. He took it pretty hard because he really thought he would get in. Stanford never interviewed him, so that reject probably didn't hurt so much (all he applied to were H/S/W). So now I guess I'm supposed to sympathize with him that he has to "settle" for Wharton. Boo hoo. He's been pretty sensitive about my rejection there though, so no hard feelings really. I just felt a little weird during the whole consolation process.

In case you were wondering...

2006-01-12T13:26:00.000-05:00

I did get into Chicago. I'm afraid I only left a subtle update yesterday when I changed my status on the right from "interviewed" to "admitted". Kudos to those who noticed. So, I got in, which is a huge relief and load off my mind. Looks like I'm definitely going to b-school this fall! So now I can just sit back and relax til I get my decisions from the other schools. Then I'll either know where I'm going because it will have been decided for me, or I'll have to make a real decision. Only time will tell...

Congrats to everyone else who got in! And to those who didn't, I was in your shoes a couple weeks ago, and also all of last year. I know, it sucks bigtime. But, eventually it will work out. Maybe not as you planned it, but c'est la vie, non?

Ha!

2006-01-04T21:06:00.000-05:00

It seems there have been a bunch of pageloads of my post about Wharton's interview policy coming from Wharton ip's today. Looks like it's more than one person too. I guess they think I have something to say about the application process that's worth reading. Or that I'm just some whiny rejected applicant. Whatever. Do with it what you will Whartonites.

Reality Checked, Then Gone

2006-01-03T11:39:00.000-05:00

Over the last two weeks I noticed that I wasn't really doing all that much in terms of my HBS app. Why you ask? Well, I think I had a reality check. I did not get into Wharton. Wharton was a perfect fit for me. As I was writing HBS essays, I knew I'd have to be really fake (for me) to sound right for them. That didn't bother me because I knew the benefit of having the HBS brand stamp was worth it for my long term career, but I found I was not as good a BSer as I thought. Then I started to think more and more about the grade disclosure policy they decided to reinstate against students' wishes and I was kind of just like, "screw this". So, I've dropped HBS.

Of course, with clarity gained in one area I've lost it in another. Somehow, I've actually developed hope of getting into Stanford. I have a couple things going for me- a seemingly great idea for the "what matters most" essay and a very solid reasoning behind my "learning objectives" essay. I'm also going to use my "connections" at an appropriate time in the application process so it might actually do something. Combine all this with a promise from God (don't ask), and I somehow have regained hope. Of course, I hate hope in this application process because it makes rejection and failure painful. And it makes me shell out an extra $200 ;).

Wharton's Interview Policy

2005-12-27T13:33:00.000-05:00

Last night I was thinking about b-school stuff, as usual, and I started to think about Wharton and their interview policy. They interview ~50% of their applicants and deny the rest. This leaves you with ~30% chance of getting in if you're interviewed. HBS has a different approach, where they interview far fewer candidates such that if you get an interview you have ~65% chance of getting in. BTW, all these statistics I'm using are numbers I worked out last year based on info provided by Wharton adcom in S2S and Businessweek's data. Presumably, if you are not selected to interview it is because you have no shot of getting in, even if you have a great interview. Therefore, if you get an interview you actually have a shot at getting in, depending on how the interview and maybe some other factors go. Reasonable assumption, yes? So, then one could conclude that Wharton either 1) places more weight on the interview than HBS, 2) does not thoroughly read the application before calling for an interview and just "overgrants" interviews figuring they'll sort it out later, 3) has some degree of inconsistency between the opinions of individual application readers and the committee as a whole and thus needs be more conservative about who they deny early, 4) has some degree of incompetence in the process relative to their peers, or 5) something I didn't consider. Now, I'm not inclined to believe #4 because Wharton is the only school I can think of that's competent enough to get all the decisions out before the holidays and have a full size applicant pool for R1. I don't know about the rest though. The only significant difference I can think of between Wharton and HBS adcoms is that Wharton has student members who need to be trained every year, thus increasing the liklihood of inconsistencies of adcom member opinions. I believe adcom members are supposed to draw the same conclusions about an application to ensure greatest consistency in the admissions process.

Now let's consider my situation. I was granted an interview at Wharton. According to what the adcom has said on S2S, that means I was a viable candidate for admission. At that point, the only thing left was the interview. Ok, so bad interview = easy ding. I happened to have had a great interview and my interviewer explicitly told me he'd recommend me at "the highest possible level". So, then if I had the best possible interview I could have possibly had (for all intensive purposes), how is it that I was still denied? That would seem to indicate that I never should have been interviewed in the first place because I never had a chance, but given my profile I can't believe I am not in the top 50% of applicants (don't mean to sound arrogant here). So what could explain this? Let's think about this. Perhaps my interviewer didn't write such a good recommendation? I considered this for while, but then I got an email from him which said he was "very surprised" by the decision. So, he most likely followed through with what he said he was going to write. Perhaps I was near the bottom of the "admitables" applicant pool and they happened to have many many great interviews this year thus rendering my great interview meaningless and thus denying me? Somehow I don't think this was the case. All I'm left with now is that either 1) Wharton has a clear idea about admission status ahead of the interview but for some reason doesn't act upon it, 2) there is some kind of disconnect between application readers and the committee process, 3) Wharton doesn't scrutinize applications that thoroughly until after interview offers go out, 4) "class sculpting" forces viable applicants in one profession/category to get denied because there are "too many" applicants from that field/group and this factor is not considered until the committee process, or 5) there is "noise" affecting admission decisions in the committee process (like someone "just doesn't like" a certain characteristic of an applicant. I presume since Wharton has so many applicants they can be picky when it comes time for admissions). I'm leaning towards #1, #4, and #5. I say "and" because I think it's mixed. Wharton says they train their readers in what to look for, etc., so I'm less inclined to believe in #2 beyond elements which would be captured in #5. #3 is just unrealistic based on the accounts of application readers like Hella.

I used Wharton and HBS in this analysis because they're the only schools I happen to know some admissions stats. Kellogg's method obviously doesn't fit this model to begin with. I am curious to know more about Stanford's stats because they also have a no-student adcom. I'd love to hear some thoughts on this since I haven't spent a ton of time thinking this thing through. I just threw it up here to get some ideas flowing and attempt to demystify the process a little. I think the admissions process should be a science, but in reality it's an art.

Of Course

2005-12-24T17:30:00.000-05:00

So my buddy did in fact get in to Wharton. Good for him. It's such a waste of an admit though. He's going to get into HBS and he'll definitely go there. My only solice is that his roommate was waitlisted, thus avoiding my worst-case rejection scenario. It's not much of a solice though because I've been reading you actually have a good shot of getting in off the waitlist during the R2 intake. Oh well. As if I was really going to cheat fate. Ha! I am destined to go to either Columbia or Chicago. I can tell you that now. Don't get me wrong, both are excellent schools one would normally be thrilled to attend. I, however, have some personal circumstances which would attach a small amount of misery to attending either school. C'est la vie, non?

So now that I'm definitely applying to Kellogg I've done more research into the program. It actually looks like it would be really good for what I need. There are some very interesting courses unlike any others I've seen at other schools. How is it that it got labeled a "Marketing" school anyway? Seems like it could be an "Everything" school. I've also decided to focus my efforts on Kellogg and Stanford, leaving HBS in the dust. It seems like such a waste to make a concerted effort for that school when I know I don't fit the school's MO. I can't even B.S. the persona well in my essays. At least with Stanford I have a great idea for my "What matters most and why?" essay. And I don't think anyone really knows what it takes to get into that place anyway. Maybe I got it? ;-p

Follow the Yellow Brick Road

2005-12-22T09:44:00.000-05:00

You'd think that following the Yellow Brick Road would lead to all kinds of good things. So, I decided to follow it. I mean, it's like a golden path, right? But then I remember what happens at the end of the road. All the people start singing a song. Do you remember how that song goes? The one that begins with the word "Ding".

Rejected. Twice. And now I'm just waiting for that phone call from my buddy saying "[Roommate] and I got in!" Ugh.

Less than a day

2005-12-21T15:05:00.000-05:00

It's less than a day until the big decision. I should be really stressed out, but I'm not. What I am though is unable to work on my other apps. I can't bring myself to do it. I just have no motivation. I keep thinking, "I already sent the apps in to all the schools I really should go to, so why am I bothering to waste my time on these others for schools I won't get into anyway?" Of course, for some reason I still have this notion that I might actually get into Wharton, which makes this whole predicament even worse. So, I've come to terms with not getting any application work done until after I get my "waitlist" tomorrow ;-). I'll have to get the applicant data sections together for Kellogg so I can get that thing out before the deadline to be eligible for interviews. Then I'll have to bust my ass on the three schools' essays I have left to do. What a depressing state of affairs that will be.

My biggest dread now is getting rejected tomorrow and my buddy who also applied R1 as well as his roommate whom I sort of know both getting in. I'm like 90% sure my buddy will get in, less sure about his roommate, but I think they both have better shots than me so it's not an unlikely situation. Man that would SUCK!!!! Especially because it would be my second rejection by them. And then to think of that girl who worked in my office and got in last year finding out! I know just the guy in the office who'll tell her too. I'm depressed just thinking about it. Well, at least I'm not stressed out... ;-)

Faster than Fate

2005-12-15T10:59:00.000-05:00

Things seem to be lining up well with Wharton for me. A little too well. Generally, the fates have conspired against me when it comes to things like this, but I kept thinking that my application is close to being as good as it could be and that my app (not specifically me though) is not rejection worthy. So, how am I going to be screwed? Were they going to let me in only to discover Wharton is not the right school for me and it was all in vain? Or were they going to let me in only to find after the first couple of months that I hate it? But then it hit me last night. Waitlist. Always forget about that damn waitlist. Enough to keep hope alive, but you might as well have been rejected. With Wharton, my guess is that like 2 people get in off the waitlist. Other schools (so the theory goes) use it strategically to boost their yield numbers. Why accept people who might not really want to go there and end up going somewhere else? Better to put them on the waitlist, and if they show the interest on the waitlist, then let 'em in. That way yield numbers are higher. Or, you accept a bunch of really good applicants, but think they're so good they'll probably go somewhere else. Got to have a backup. But, Wharton is generally one of those "somewhere else" schools, so they don't need to have much in terms of backups. So, I don't know. Realizing that I haven't been thinking about the decision date much has now made me start thinking about it. And I'm soooo far behind with my other apps that I'm not even sure I'll be able to get them all in. HBS is making it a little easier though with the whole grade disclosure thing. I've decided to stop working on that app for now and focus on Stanford. If I get in to Wharton though, then I won't apply to Kellogg and I'll have the time I need to send out HBS and Stanford. I figure I might as well just send 'em out after having put in all the effort thus far. Neither are better for what I want to do, but the cold weather these days is making me dream of Cali and I'd really like to be able to use the Harvard club in NY ;-). I'm going to send Columbia out this week. Really easy app for reapplicants. I've been pushing it off for too long.

I guess we'll just have to keep waiting... One week and counting.

The Wharton Interview

2005-12-13T17:19:00.000-05:00

So I had my Wharton interview a couple days ago. The first thing that comes to mind when I think about it is, "Thank God I didn't go on-campus." If you recall, I had this whole strategy around doing on alumni interview because of some connection I knew one of my potential interviewers and I had. I also didn't want to run the risk of a female student with little connection to finance (like last year) interviewing me on-campus (there's a theory out there that female students are more inclined to connect with female applicants because of the whole "women in business are a minority" connection thing. I doubt this is 100% true, but I'm not willing to take the risk. Also note I am not making any statements for people to go voicing their opinions on either). Anyway, the more important thing is that my strategy totally worked. I made an instant connection with my interviewer based on that common thing we have, and the interview became very conversational and relaxed. We talked for over an hour, half interview stuff, half discussing the common thing, switching back and forth as we pleased. I told him about my interview last year and the feedback I got on it, and he was actually a little pissed off that the girl who interviewed me made those comments! He was shocked that I didn't get in last year (granted, I didn't mention that my essays then weren't particularly good). And at the end, he said he'd recommend me at the highest possible level. So, all and all, I think it went well :-).

At this point, I put my chances at 50/50 to get in. Getting an interview puts you at a 1/3 chance, but the good interview makes me bump it up to 1/2. Why not higher you ask? Well, it is Wharton man. Nothing is guaranteed. And life doesn't normally work out so well for me. But, at the very least, I haven't really thought about it at all. I should be stressed out with so little time left, but I'm fine. I wonder if I'll even remember to check my status next Thursday (I read that decisions will not be coming out early this year)... Good luck to all.

Interviews, with a touch of vagueness to protect the innocent

2005-11-30T18:08:00.000-05:00

Last weekend I had my interview with Chicago. Went well, I'm pretty sure I'll be getting in now given the rest of my app and some other stuff. What I'm more concerned about is my Wharton interview. I finally got it scheduled after it took a while to hear back from my interviewer. Graham at Clear Admit had been advising me to do an on-campus interview for reasons I totally believe even though they sort of contradict what Wharton says (note: this was advice specifically for me, not for everyone). I didn't want to do the on-campus interview because there's too much randomness with it. You have no control over who interviews you, and the 30-minute time limit is pretty firm. With an alumnus, I could at least control certain factors (male/female and occupation) and it could go on for an hour if the alum doesn't care about the guidelines and is more concerned with getting to know me better. Time pressure increases the chances the interviewer will gloss over something and not get as detailed an answer as they'd like since they need to cover other topics too. But, then it's easy for me to say all this since I've done the on-campus interview before. Last year I had a girl in the healthcare program interview me and there was clearly no connection. And I have no idea where she came up with one of the comments she did (heard it in the feedback session). I do not want to go through that again. Anyway, Graham really had me thinking about it and I was about to do it until I did a deeper internet search on my potential interviewers and found what I needed- a guy who works in finance and, well, let's just say has had a very similar experience in life as me (I might be revealing too much to any potential adcom viewers if I say more). That experience will easily be a major connection point for us and he'll be able to give me a certain perspective on Wharton I haven't been able to find thus far. Of course, I don't want to count my chickens before they hatch so I'm not thinking any of this is going to work for me. It could all blow up in my face. We'll just have to wait and see...

T-minus 20.58 days and counting...

Relief

2005-11-15T17:15:00.000-05:00

"Umm... Yeah... Umm... We kinda lost your application there, umm... Yeah..."

This was one of the many thoughts that was going through my mind the last couple days in regards to not hearing back from Wharton for an interview. I also spent a lot of time doubting myself, thinking that perhaps I really didn't do a significantly better app this year and, even though I got an interview last year, since I didn't do anything better this time around adcom would just save themselves the trouble and ding me now. Well, much to my relief this is not the case. I finally got my interview!! Now, that doesn't mean my app is actually better this year, but let's just assume so for now ;-). I've decided on an alumni interview this time. I think I can increase the likelihood of a good interview by making sure it is with someone who actually works in a field related to my own. Really, it doesn't guarantee anything great, but it means I need to spend less time explaining my job and less time convincing them of how difficult it is. And there'll be natural work-related topics for conversation. I'll also make sure the alum is young, further increasing the chances of developing a good rapport with him/her. And with any luck, my strategy will work and I'll get in. We'll just have to see...

Complete

2005-11-03T13:11:00.000-05:00

Lately I've been wondering a lot about Wharton's Interview Invitations. Checking the boards to see how many have gone out, etc. Still haven't got mine yet :). And then it occurred to me I did apply to a second school R1- Chicago. And that led me to realize I had never received an email saying my app was complete. So I logged in, checked the ol' status, and there it was, "Complete". I know I was only "Received" a couple days ago, but little idea when I actually went complete. You know, it would have been nice to have gotten an email to indicate the status change. To all those who applied to Chicago I suggest you log in and check it out if you haven't already.

Freedom

2005-10-31T13:43:00.000-05:00

With all of my R1 apps sent out, I finally had a "free" weekend. There was nothing I had to do, and so I did nothing. And I mean nothing. Except laundry. Had it not been for laundry, I probably wouldn't have left my apartment. And it was great. I had completely forgot what it felt like to do nothing and not have something eating away in the back of my mind. And once I got the point where I was actually bored with doing nothing (Sunday, after football), I was truly free. Even though I could be working on R2 apps, I'm not. I'm going to continue my hiatus, catch a movie, get a drink with some friends, etc. Next weekend, it all begins again.

My game plan:

There are about ten weeks before R2 apps start coming due. I'm planning to start working on Harvard first. I already mapped out all of my essays for that sucker, so it shouldn't be too much effort. Then, I'll take care of Columbia. Columbia will be easy since there's only one reapp essay and it's basically the same as Wharton's (the "why" and "how have you improved" essay). It'll take no more than a week. Then I will undertake the hardest of them all, Stanford. Most people enjoy writing Stanford's essay A because they're writing about what's closest to their hearts and are really the most passionate about. That and there's no word limit ;-). But, I did that last year and I didn't get in. They tell you to just be honest. But they also tell you (indirectly) that saying something like "family" is not going to get you in. If you spin it the right way it will, but then it's not so much the "family" as the "spin" that got you in. This essay requires you to write about "what matters most", but also to write a b-school essay just like any other. Basically, what matters most shouldn't be a person/thing like a family member or money. It should be an adverb (like "winning", except "winning" is not a good choice) or an ideal (virtuous?), and probably one that fits with all the b-school-esqe themes floating around. Frame it in some kind of experience you've had and you're set. Or at least that's what I think. I could be wrong or missing something. Anyway, I have an idea for this sucker, but it's not going to be easy. So, I'm devoting a lot of time to it. Probably like four weeks or something. Really, what I'm shooting for is finishing HBS, CBS, and Stanford by Dec 23. By that time I'll have gotten an answer from Wharton. If by some miracle the Gods have smiled upon me, I'll just send those apps in and take it easy. If the likely event does occur, then I'll send in Kellogg section 1 by the interview deadline and spend two weeks hardcore and get that thing out for R2. Christmas week is a good time to get shit done since the office is normally slow. And if I start sweating that I won't get into the GSB, then I might scrape something together for Duke.

This blog has its first taste of smut

2005-10-31T13:40:00.000-05:00

Did anybody see the comment from Oct 31 in my previous post? It is just so ridiculous. I've seen a lot of comment ads for stocks or mortgage refi, but this is the first I've seen for porn. And on my blog too! I'm going to leave it up for a little while for the hell of it.

Just another day

2005-10-13T17:50:00.000-04:00

Today I said goodbye to my Wharton application. Sent it in a bit before the 5pm crunch. I had sent my essays to my buddy last night to read over, got some edits, reworked them a little bit around 3pm today, and that was that. I don't think they were going to get much better than what they were. And if Wharton expected better, well, that sucks for me. Now, it's all about Chicago...

No Stress

2005-10-11T17:43:00.000-04:00

It's really pretty amazing. It just occurred to me that Wharton is due in 2 days and I'm not stressed out at all. I still have work to do on essay 1 and one of my recommenders has given me no status update about whether he's done the rec or not, but I'm not stressed for some reason. Maybe I'm just used to this whole application nonsense and it doesn't phase me. Last year around this time I could feel my muscles twisting into knots. This year... eh. And Wharton is really my most important app too because I think it's the furthest reach of schools I think I have a real shot at getting into. I feel like this year there is no good reason not to accept me, even though I'm sure I won't get in. Maybe I'm just tired and want this shit to be over. I don't know. Anyway, good luck to all.

And Wharton, if you're reading this, I'm very disappointed with your online application. I wouldn't have expected these kinds of shenanigans from you.

Bam!

2005-10-07T12:27:00.000-04:00

I just came up with a great idea for Chicago essay number 3. Kind of covers choice 1 and 2 at the same time. I adapted it out of an idea I had developed for the "Discuss a time you questioned your ethics or values" question. This is such a relief because I was really struggling to come up with anything for it and was dreading I was just going to have to make up some BS.

Take that Chicago! A little Essence of Redwolf. Now it's time for number 4...

T-minus 1 week and Counting...

2005-10-06T14:56:00.000-04:00

Ok boys and girls, the shit is on! Only one little week until our old friend Joe stops taking apps to his fine school for R1. I can't wait to be done with it. Actually, all that means is I'll have two weeks to get my app to Chicago done and can start stressing about that. This whole application process sucks. Have I mentioned that before? So much slaving effort to put into essays, some of which are total bs, and all so that someone can spend around 30 minutes looking at it and say "yea" or "nay". If "yea", then your "ROI", to start using b-school speak, will go up with more adcom time spent reading it. Anyway, I'm sick of rewriting the same shit over and over to try to say it better than I did the previous time using less words. Damn you word length! It's especially frustrating because as a reapplicant you only get to write two essays for Wharton- the "why" essay and one of your choice between the others on the regular app. They don't even bother (most of the time) to look at your previous app. Now, this is both a good and a bad. The good is that the app last year didn't get you in, and in my case just sucked, so you don't want them looking at it. The bad is that you have to paint an entire picture of yourself just like everyone else in only 60% of the space. And you also have to be specific in addressing how you've improved since last year. This just doesn't seem logical to me. I'm thinking what really happens is the reader reads the comments from last year and primarily looks at the app this year with those in mind. So, if your comments said you had a good understanding of the school and knew a lot about the program, you don't need to add that to the app this year. That would make the limited amount of space for the reapp seem more reasonable, and also make it easier on the adcom as they've already done a full evaluation of the candidate once before and don't need to do a full one again. Of course, one can never assume anything when it comes to b-school apps so this theory is really nothing short of a gamble. Ok, I'm going to stop here as I'm only building myself up for a rant. Time to get back to working on this stuff, again. I'm spending so much time on Wharton I think I'm screwing myself for Chicago a bit. Only got two of the four planned out, and I have no idea what to write for the other two. One problem at a time...

Caves and the People Who Hide in Them

2005-09-29T16:44:00.000-04:00

Man, no one is blogging this week. I can just picture Clear Admit's Fridays From The Frontline post - "Redwolf blogs about no one blogging".

It's been pretty hellish for me between work and b-school apps. I should say "Wharton" app. Chicago's a secondary concern at this time. 2 weeks and counting...

Status Update

2005-09-19T15:11:00.000-04:00

Oh man, does it suck to be here. I just got back from a much needed two week vacation. I wanted to do some application work while I was away, but of course I only did about 2 hours worth (although I did spend several hours here and there planning out Stanford's what matters most essay in my head) and now I'm going to be paying the price. Back to work with, luckily, not many pressing matters to take care of. But I am jet lagged and don't expect to get any essay work done tonight. At this point, I've written my first draft of my why mba essay for Wharton. I don't expect to do much more to it as I've spent so much time planning it and refining it in my head over the summer. The second essay for Wharton is also all planned out, just needs to be written up. So I'm not worrying about that school. Chicago, on the other hand, is a problem. It's the one school I really don't even know what to write for all the essays. I got essay 1 and 2 down. Similar stuff to what I'm doing for Wharton. But essays 3 and 4... I got nothing. I was even on vacation with three GSB students and when I told them the questions and asked if they had any ideas the best they could come up with was "[laughing] those questions suck dude!" None of the brainstorming I've done is applicable to any of these questions. Little words like "strong" and "biggest" in the phrasing of the question make the events I would have used for the essay seem inappropriate. For instance, I have a great "failure" essay all worked out, but the failure was certainly not my "biggest" and it would be hard to convince to that effect. So, I'm kind of stuck. I'm going to have to do a lot of brainstorming to come up with something for it. Oh well, at least the app isn't due until the end of October...

And so it begins

2005-08-26T18:49:00.000-04:00

I have now done all the research I'm going to in regards to my essays for this year. I know pretty much what to say, custom tailored for each school. But now I must buckle down and start writing. Easier said than done. There's so much that needs to be put together it's hard to know where to start. Well, that's not true. I know I need to start with the "why everything" essay, but after that I'm not so sure. Too many apps, too many essays, too many ideas. I'll probably create a chart of some sort which will identify the key points of each essay I'm planning to put together, then figure out which ones to match up with which app (see previous posts 1 and 2) to tell the best story. But, that'll involve at least outlining every essay I'm planning to write when most of my apps aren't going to be until round 2! Not to mention I might have some great essay-fodder between now and round 2 submission time. Oh well. If history is a good predictor of the future, by the end of this weekend all this insanity might just turn into genius. Time to start finding that fine line...

Squashing a Bug

2005-08-19T15:18:00.000-04:00

Got my results back on the CFA Level III exam- I passed! Huge relief that I am now finally done with that retched program. The results had been like an insect clawing away at the back of my mind for the last week. This year Level III was, imo, particularly difficult so I was really worried I wouldn't pass. The thought of having to do all that studying again next year was so painful I forced myself not to think about it.

I think the CFA is a really worthwhile program to give future PMs a solid foundation in investment management, but I don't like the way it's been administrated lately. Seems like they're all about trying to make this thing really exclusive by making the test harder every year. The thing that got to me the most was the crap they pulled last year with the really really low pass rates claiming that the only reason they could come up with for this was that people were not studying the designated materials and were using study notes too much. I only used the study notes and passed! They were just pissed because they were paying people to write CFA branded textbooks and they weren't selling many. The CFAI is supposed to be a non-profit organization. Considering the amount of money they charge for the test and the seemingly low costs, I don't know why they need more money from textbook sales. I'd love to see their IS and BS. I do know that Thomas Bowman, CFAI's ex-CEO, made more than $900K in the year 2002. Am I wrong in thinking that's a lot of comp at a non-profit? I honestly don't know what CEO pay is at non-profits, but $900K is more than a lot of for-profit CEO's make! And I doubt the job is as hard as it is at another non-profit since the CFA program likely provides the organization with plenty of funding. The CEO of the Metropolitan Museum of Art only made around $500K that year, but I know there's a lot of fundraising work at that job!

Misinterpretations

2005-08-12T14:52:00.000-04:00

Obviously I was not clear enough about what I was suggesting in my previous post about tackling essays. I was taking certain experiences I have had in the application process for granted. For all those people just starting out-

1) Don't attempt to write essays about things you think the adcom wants to hear
2) Don't start with lessons and work your way back to questions

I know, this is pretty much opposite of what I was suggesting in my previous post. I failed to note that my suggestion was really only applicable to the experienced applicant who has spent lots of time thinking about essays and how to construct an application. Most will say that the suggestions wouldn't even apply to them, so allow me to clarify.

An application is a self-portrait you present to an adcom to tell them who you are and why you need to go to their school. As any art lover knows, a portrait of a person can be painted in many many ways, each attempting to capture whatever it is the artist sees in the person. When you create your application, you need to know what it is you want to say about yourself. Easier said than done. Most will start out trying to answer individual essay questions. After numerous revisions, a cohesive semblence of "who you are" might eventually start to form. Then you'll realize that the "who" is not necessarily your best face, so to speak, simply because an application is too short to paint a complete picture of who you are so you are left to paint the best incomplete picture and make it seem complete. You'll start to tweak your essays to highlight the areas you feel are your best attributes (in combination), and then, perhaps, you'll actually get an application you're proud of. In my case, I've already gotten to the point of knowing who I am and I've spent much time thinking about what my best face is. Here is where my idea comes in and is different from the commonly prescribed path. At this point, I want to start over with essay ideas. I just want to brainstorm now. Forget the questions for the brainstorming, but pay attention to the questions when I write the essays (duh)!! So I try starting from the end-

What lessons are there to be learned?
Will any of these fit with the portrait I've envisioned?
What experiences led to these lessons?
And, finally, will any of these experiences actually fit with the questions asked by the schools?

One of the main reasons why people who try to write what they think the adcom wants to hear fail is because they do not create a cohesive semblance of a person. Instead, they present scattered fragments that do not a person make. Also, people are not naturally inclined to think about all the different aspects of a person who is not themselves. If you invented a persona for the adcom, would think about this person's favorite color? The little things make us who we are, and if you don't know what those things are you probably don't know who "you" are. So, to all those thinking about making stuff up, leave this practice to the thespians of the world.

So, when I refered to "what the adcom wants to hear", I was really talking about the pieces of my actual self that are relevant to the b-school application and which will, in combination, create the best self-portrait (remember, "best" is relative so you need to think about who your audience is when you determine it). I'm guessing the adcom is not interested in, for instance, the experiences in which I have learned ways to manipulate people. But they probably would be interested in the experiences which have taught me the value of teamwork.

Back to my point- a person can learn many lessons from a single experience, so I am merely suggesting that one starts by brainstorming lessons and figure out how they could together create the right portrait of oneself. Then, think about the experiences in your life which have taught you these lessons, and see if they answer the questions asked. Who knows if they will? Adcoms ask very specific questions because they think these questions will allow you to paint a picture about yourself as well as address key issues related to the MBA experience (ex. leadership, teamwork, values, etc). In the Fog of War, McNamara says something like "answer the question, but when you're asked a question you don't want to answer, answer the question you wish you were asked." Don't do that here. While you may make a better portrait of yourself, you will also not address the issues adcom want answers on, and they're likely smart enough to know what you're doing.

Working backwards could produce undesirable results. Maybe the app as a whole just won't seem right. In regression analysis three or four independent variables might each be highly correlated with your dependent variable, but in combination they do not work. In the same way, there might be a group of lessons that all seem great, but together they do not work. Your portrait might end up looking like a Picasso, which is brilliant to those who can see it, but just looks chaotic to those who can't see past this. The adcom, while experienced "art critics", probably don't have the time to look beyond any chaos. Therefore, a straight forward cohesive application is best. The path I'm suggesting might or might not get you there. At worst I think it'll help one to develop a better total picture of oneself. It probably won't be an easy journey, but the results could be great...

Behind, ahead, or is she just way ahead?

2005-08-09T18:14:00.000-04:00

Visited Axechick's blog yesterday and was on the verge of freakin out. Dude, she is so far ahead of me it's sick. And I've already applied once before! I had been planning on starting my apps "early" this year by cracking on them in August, but it would appear that's not even enough to stay competitive. And they wonder why b-schoolers need grade non-disclosure :-). I'm exagerating a bit here, but there is something to be said for how hard it is to apply to b-school. The competition is just so good you really need to spend a lot of time if you want to attempt to distinguish yourself. Axechick is probably just ahead of everyone else (kudos to you Axechick!), but that's the kind of effort you probably need to make if you want to get in to a school like HBS. So many people have great stories, but a lot of it comes down to how well you tell it on paper. I remember hearing that in the early 90s the average GMAT for the top b-schools was only in the low 600s, so I can only imagine what it's going to be like ten years from now. Considering how much harder it is to get into a top college than when I went to high school, I'm sure this competitive effect will carry over for when the current college freshmen go to grad school. I wonder if they're all going to burn out one day...

This year I've decided to apply to a few schools in round 1 and a few in round 2. For round 1 I'm planning to apply to Wharton and Chicago. Wharton strongly encourages its reapps to apply "when they're ready", but really they'd prefer round 1. Some think that in general round 1 is better to apply in because there are less people who apply that round, more seats are available, and it shows you're a "go-getter" or some crap like that. On the other hand, if this "go-getter" self-selection theory is true you'll also be up against a greater proportion of stronger applicants. I'm holding off on a lot of apps until round 2 because I've been doing some extra work on the side at a startup which will address my leadership/managerial needs and I'd like to have more time doing that stuff before I write my essays. More experiences and "lessons" to work off of. So, I'm going to apply to HBS, Stanford, Kellogg, and Columbia round 2/RD. HBS and Stanford don't even bother to keep your apps from last year so I'm not going to bother to claim to be a reapplicant. My app last year sucked in comparison to what I'm planning to put out so I'd rather not have any affiliation with it. Too bad Wharton and Columbia don't give you this option. I thought about applying to Columbia ED but I don't think I really want to commit to going there just to increase my chances of getting in. I'll probably just send in my app early, Novemberish.

Some will note that I added Chicago and Kellogg to the list this year. I still would rather go to one of the four I applied to last year, but I need to increase my odds of getting in somewhere this year. I'm also thinking of applying to Fuqua after hearing some good things about it. Supposedly not a lot of competition for Sales and Trading jobs but a strong alumni network and pretty good recruiting. Add to that nice weather and a fun school environment and it might just be ideal...

Lessons Learned

2005-08-05T14:29:00.000-04:00

It's August. Time has crept up on me. Time to start working on the apps. Make a real effort this year. Last year I put together my apps in 2-3 weeks. This time, I intend to create the Uber-App.

Most essay questions have come out and I've begun to think about what to write. My experience last year has indicated that writing about interesting events or creating beautiful prose means jack with the adcoms. Maybe just a little bit. What they really care about is "what I've learned from my experiences". So, I've decided to take a different approach to essay writing this year. I say forget about the questions themselves (expect for the why mba / why b-school / why everything essay which is more or less separate from what I'm talking about here). They don't really matter. What does matter are the "lessons". The things one has "learned". Some may disagree saying that each person's experiences are unique so you can't just start with lessons. I say that while not all lessons will be applicable to a given person, many will because, even though we do not all share the same experiences, different experiences can easily lead to the same lesson. The key is to first determine the lesson, then think back in your life about where you learned it. I think people often take their life lessons for granted so it's easier to start with lessons and think about what experiences lead to them rather than start with experiences and figure out if you learned anything from them. Once you've got your lessons figured out and the experiences which lead to you learning them, you can then try to match them up to essay questions.

So, I started to brainstorm about things adcoms would like to see you've "learned". Here's where I started to falter. The best one I could come up with was "learned to listen to others in a team setting". Honestly, I'm really not sure what kind of lessons adcoms are looking for. That's the thing they don't guide you on. Either that or something's just not clicking for me. I presume they want to see lessons that have made one grow as a human being rather than "learning" how to do something like ride a bike. So, I was wondering if you aspiring applicants and admits had any good ideas? I know I'm asking a really broad question, but I think this would be really useful to every applicant as a starting point for brainstorming their essays. Post some comments and we'll see how it goes!

The Ol' Feedback Session

2005-06-20T19:09:00.000-04:00

Not too long ago I had a feedback session with Wharton. It's a blog post I've been meaning to do for a while but for some reason have just not gotten around to it. Unlike some others, I thought my feedback session went smoothly and was fairly productive. As it turned out, much of the feedback they gave was not as useful as the feedback they didn't give...

The problems they cited-

1) Leadership and managerial experience. Not too surprising, this is exactly what I figured they'd get me on as I basically had none (in my app). They were even like, "We understand it's generally difficult for research analysts to demonstrate leadership/management, so we tend to look for it in the extracurriculars and community service." At first I was fairly impressed they were capable of making that kind of distinguishment in their expectations for candidates, and then I wondered if I really even should be. Have I come to expect so little from adcoms? Oh well...

2) Verbal skills. Specifically my analytical capabilities. This really surprised me as these are generally considered by myself and by others to be amongst my greatest strengths. They couldn't directly comment on the contents of my interview because it's "confidential", which made it a pain in the ass to actually get feedback on, but basically they said I answered questions directly but did not probe deep enough in my responses. As they were telling me this, all I could think about was how my interviewer back in December explicitly said the interview would be very casual and how my answers were, accordingly, fairly casual. It was a conversation, not a thought-provoking discussion requiring depth and insight. When she asked me about my job I didn't go into details and I even told her it was because I do really quantitative research and most people find it uninteresting and hard to understand. Guess I'll have to make sure I'm more direct and thorough next time around.

3) Short term goals. I didn't really list a short term goal, which just was a mistake. In fact, I said my short term goal was to get into an MBA program :-). This is an easy answer for me, I just dropped the ball. I know exactly what I want to do after b-school (it's the main reason for going!), but for some reason I didn't think they were interested in it. What was I thinking?

4) Typo. I had a typo in my work experience section that made it seem like I spent a year less than I really did at a former job. Dumb ass! I spent so much time proofing my essays I missed a big mistake elsewhere. Although, if the reader had really paid attention, he/she would have noticed that in my reason for leaving I wrote the actual number of years I had been there and that the total number of months of work experience I claimed I would have at matriculation was a year longer than the sum of the years listed in the work experience section.

Note to self, readers do not read that thoroughly, but you must answer thoroughly. Hmmmm...

Before I had the feedback session I thought over my app and figured my biggest weaknesses were leadership and extracurriculars. I had planned on a major change in my work experience because of this partly to address my weaknesses, and partly because I was ready to leave my job for b-school this year anyway. Interestingly enough, leadership they agreed on but extracurrics they did not. Most surprising since I really haven't done much with my free time post college other than the CFA and some writing. I ran the work experience change by them anyway during the feedback session, and they were not so thrilled with the idea. Of course they'll never ever give you a straight answer one way or the other, but you can generally tell by the way they respond or the hesitancy/positiveness in their voice. How's that for probity :P? So, that meant I was just going to have to keep on working at my current job and do something else on the side to get the leadership stuff covered. Luckily I've already got something going that's really interesting. I think this experience, along with the fact that I'll be a year older and I know far better what to write in my essays (for each school even), will make me a most formidable applicant. Wharton, your ass is mine.

Need an Apartment?

2005-06-10T13:32:00.000-04:00

I visit CNN.com once a day to catch up on what I call "trash" news. Every so often they inform me of some true gems on the internet which I had no idea existed. Fat Wallet has proven to be the best thus far, but today I came across an excellent second- Housingmaps.com. This site is awesome. It combines Craigslist and Google Maps to provide apartment listings identified on a city map. If you've ever used Craigslist before, you'll know it can be a pain to look through the apartment descriptions because there's no good template to identify the characteristics one is looking for. Now, you can see where the listings plot on a map, click on the ones of interest, and pull up the details. It makes it much easier to identify new listings as well. I'm not sure if every Craigslist listing makes it onto Housingmaps.com, but you can figure that out for yourself. Check it out!

Once More Into The Breach, Dear Friends

2005-06-02T21:13:00.000-04:00

I've been MIA this week, much to my pleasure and to my dismay. Taking the week off from work is an enjoyable experience- sleeping late, watching some tv, NOT having to work, etc. - but, unfortunately, studying for the CFA exam sucks ass! Yes, my friends, in a day and a half I will be struggling through that most vile of temptresses, the CFA Level III exam. I call her a temptress because she lures you in with comforting thoughts like "you're almost done, just this one more and you'll have that nice shiny 'CFA' to add to your business card and command a degree of additional respect in the marketplace," only to later bitch-slap you as the day approaches with, "oh you think I'm some sort of slut do you? I ain't that easy. Just because I have the highest pass rate of the three doesn't mean I give it up to just anybody, foo'. The pass rate is just a selection bias. Oh, and while you're at it, describe three problems models face from selection bias (9 minutes)." I think the pass rate was in the high 50s / low 60s last year, which is pretty bad when you think about it. All these people passed Level II at somepoint with its 32-50% pass rate, and now 40% of them can't pass Level III? Man I'd really hate to fail. The thought of another year of this shit is just depressing. The best advice I can give to anyone thinking about getting a CFA charter is to do it ASAP if you're going to. They seem to be making it harder every year that goes by...

Good luck to all my brothers and sisters in arms ths weekend! And may your boozin' surpass my own Saturday night!

What do I need to get in?

2005-05-24T14:15:00.000-04:00

For some strange reason, I find myself visiting the message boards here and there when I'm bored at work. I have no idea why since I never find anything of interest there. Clearly, I've reached "the end of the internet." Anyway, one phenomenon I became increasingly aware of is that there always seems to be someone saying, "Here is my profile, is it good enough to get in?" It is often from an International applicant, which is understandable because they are not surrounded by products of the American education system and probably do not have friends from college/work or siblings who have gone through the MBA application process. And considering most other graduate programs (ex. law school) are heavily dependent upon a scoring system using factors like GPA, standardized test scores, etc., it is quite understandable that someone would assume the same for b-school. But, that is not the case. B-school applications are an art, not a science. While it is excusable not to know this going in to the process, it is incredibly tiresome to find people asking the same questions over and over instead of spending some time researching the whole thing in the first place. Answers to all application questions can probably be found with a little searching effort. It amazes me that someone who is considering an MBA has done so little effort in his/her research to figure out if it's even worth considering that he/she wouldn't know there is no set "scoring system". I think the schools have been fairly open on that one thus far.

In light of this, I've decided to post Redwolf's Very Rough Approximation of a Guide to Getting into B-school. It covers what I think are the basics, not to determine if one will get in, but if one is "competitive" amongst applicants for a top MBA program. As you'll see, certain topics are very vague. This post would probably be more valuable had it come out in the fall when most people are thinking about b-school, but I'm doing it now because I feel like it and I'm feeling inclined to help those who have gotten their shit together early and are considering an MBA now. Besides, what else are archives for?

The Guide

B-schools "grade" you on four major categories- Academics, Goals, Experience/Leadership, and something I'll call "Worldliness".

Academics

GPA: There is no "minimum score". If you'll notice, the average GPA for the top MBA programs is around 3.5 while the average GPA for the top Law schools is around a 3.8. Clearly, GPA does not matter as much (I think it's unlikely that MBA applicants are less intelligent than Law School applicants and so their GPAs are lower). But, that doesn't mean if you have a 2.0 you stand a good shot if you're average in every other category. The GPA and the GMAT are used to reflect your ability to handle the academic rigour of the program. If you meet the minimum requirements, you're pretty much all the same as far as the b-school is concerned. I'd speculate if you have a 3.0 or above you're in contention, provided your GMAT is sufficient. GMAT seems to be the more important Academic factor.

GMAT: Again, no "minimum score". But, schools have been more explicit about this one. Some believe that as long as you break 700 you're ok. I'd beg to differ. I think the composite score isn't as important as the individual scores. Wharton has explicitly stated they want an 80%/80% split between quant and verbal (that's percentile, not raw score), and other schools seem to follow this as well. That's not to say if you get less you won't get in, but if you do it is a cause for concern. Contrary to popular belief, I don't think a GMAT of 750+ means anything more than a GMAT of 710 in the adcoms' eyes.

Goals

This section is the simplest part. You've got to be able to clearly articulate why you want, actually I should say "need", an MBA. First priority- long term career objective. Shoot for the stars with this one (ex. CEO, run your own Private Equity shop, etc.), but make sure it makes sense (don't say Chairman of the Fed if you were an Art History major and work at a non-profit). The nice thing about b-school is that it is what I call a "start over card". One of the most common uses of the MBA is to change one's career path, and this is a totally acceptable answer as far as the adcoms are concerned. They just want to make sure you've thought about it thoroughly and the MBA is the best path towards achieving your goals. You have to be able to say "I know currently know X, but I need to learn Y to become [long term goal] and b-school is the best place to learn that." Finally, you need to paint the picture of how you intend to go from b-school to the long term goal. Talk about the job you want straight out of b-school and how it makes sense as a stepping stone to the long-term goal. Adcoms can't always figure this part out.

Experience/Leadership

This and Goals section are the most important categories. This basically comes down to two things- your work experience section of the app and your essays. On the numbers end, you probably need at least four years of work experience (three if you've worked in a slave-type job like I-Banking). But that number is nowhere near set in stone. What really matters is how you've developed as a professional. Experiences themselves seem to count for very little. All the adcom cares about is what you've learned from the experience. They want to know about you the person, not you the short bio. That is how you make use of the essays. List your work experience in the work experience section, but in the essays tell the adcom how these experiences have shaped what kind of professional you are. And, of course, the most important trait they're looking for is Leadership. They want to see that you have experience leading from your work experience or extra-curricular activities and that you've learned something from these experiences. They seem to understand that some professions are not conducive towards leadership experiences (ex. research analyst), so then they look for it in the extra-curriculars and maybe try to infer it from the essays. The real challenge in this section is trying to explain everything you've learned sufficiently in 1,000 words or less.

Worldliness

This is a slightly less important category, but still something that can keep you out. Basically, b-schools don't want corporate flunkies for their students. Nor do they just want professionals. They want people. If all you've done is work at your job and haven't been a part of something other than your company and family, you need to do something else. They love volunteering. It shows you have interest in things outside of work but also that you actually want to give back to the community. B-schools like their alumni to be philanthropists. Also, they want their students to be open to other people's ideas. That's part of the whole learning process at b-school- learning from each other. If you can show that you have a "worldly" perspective, it implies that you're willing to hear other points of view and potentially change your own. It also means that you'll be able to add a melange of viewpoints to any discussion. Oh, and if you're international and thinking "I'm from another country so I can add a different perspective to all the Americans at b-school", guess what- so are all the other applicants from your country. Just being from another country doesn't make one more "worldly" or "open-minded".

That's about it for this "guide". I'm sure I've missed things and I'm probably a little off on a thing or two, but I think this pretty much covers the basics. Any comments/additions would be welcome. Remember, it's easy for a school to reject an applicant, but harder to reject a person. Use the application to show them who you are. You may be great and all, but if you don't tell them how in your essays how are they going to know?

Answers Sought

2005-05-20T12:50:00.000-04:00

Next week I get some of the answers I've been seeking. I will finally know what the Wharton adcom thought of my application and hopefully get some guidance on ways to improve. I'm not going to ask questions like "uhhh, well what should I do to get in?" because, frankly, that's kind of pathetic. If you're going to be a future leader of the world and all that crap you should have some idea of what you can do with your life in the next 5 months to make your app more appealing. Instead, what I've done is identified all the areas I think the adcom would feel I was weak in and come up with a few ideas about how I can address these issues, and then I'm going to ask my feedback interviewer what he/she thinks of them. IMO, a good leader will come up with solutions to problems, but a good leader will also seek the wisdom of his/her advisors before deciding on any mildly time sensitive issues. I doubt I'll get an straight answer like "yeah, that's a really good idea. I think you should do it" because the adcom is full of crap like "there are many paths one can take to get in". I know there are many paths, but I'm already on one right now and I need to pick the next step that will work best given my path to date. There are clearly going to be better options than others because some experiences, by their very nature, are condusive towards learning certain lessons. If you're weak in leadership and management, taking a position running an extra-curricular you're involved in is probably a better choice than just continuing doing whatever it is you've done so far. Since I'll never get a straight answer, I'm just going to have to look for emotion. Yes, emotion. If I can detect some slight hesitancy or it's clear they're enthusiastic about the "it sounds like it could be a good experience for you but..." half of their PC response, I'll have my answer. Even though they don't want to make any sort of career directional advice, it is rare for someone to hide their emotions in a response. If only I could do it in person, then I'd really be able to tell...

It should be noted "areas I think the adcom would feel I was weak in" is different than what "I" think I am weak in. The adcom only knows me in the context of my app whereas I know myself in many more ways. It's not easy to convey a completely accurate portrait of oneself in an app and many things do not always show up. Sometimes we'll take some of our biggest strengths and not describe them as such in the app because we've just come to take them for granted. This makes it key to try to step outside of yourself when reviewing your app for weaknesses.

The CFA Exam

2005-05-10T10:44:00.000-04:00

Studying for the CFA exam just plain sucks. I think I will forever have a negative connotation associated with the month of May. The test may be the first Saturday in June, but May is when you really have your life torn away from you. Or at least from those of us who stand a shot at passing and aren't some kind of crazy supergenius. Last year the CFA board decided to make the passing rate really low (Level 1: 34%, Level 2: 32%, Level 3: 64%). I say "decided to" because technically there is no cutoff score that decides a pass or fail on the exam. They do some kind of bizarre psychological test to determine something like "what is the lowest score a passing person would get". Of course, they don't say what defines a "passing person". I don't remember exactly how it works, just remember it seemed like a lot of BS. Basically the passing grade ranges from between 60-70%. There has been a recent surge in candidates trying to get the CFA charter so I think what's really going on is they're trying to make the test more exclusive. If the finance community thinks anyone can get it, why would anyone attach value to it? Also, even though the CFA Institute is a non-profit org, it would seem $$ are on the minds of the board members as well. In a letter to all the candidates which accompanied test results, the board claimed they could think of no reason why the pass rates were so low except that candidates were not doing the assigned readings (ie. buying the books). Did I mention the assigned readings are now all written, published, and sold by the CFA Institute? They said candidates were relying on "study notes" sold by outside test prep companies too much. Now, if that were really true, how is it that I was able to pass using only the study notes? Perhaps it's because I also bought the "assigned readings"- I just didn't use them. In fact, of the six people I know who took the exam last year, the ones who bought the assigned readings passed whether they read them or not, and those who only bought the study notes did not. Probably just coincidence because I doubt the CFA Institute could be so unethical.
Ethics is 10% of the test after all ;-).

Reviving what I thought was a dead post

2005-05-01T00:52:00.000-04:00

Saturday night and writing a post. Yes, it's May, I'm studying for the CFA, and my life is on hold for the next month. Gotta love it.

Axechick wrote a post in response to something I wrote a while back, and after I finished typing up a comment for her blog I thought it was too long to post as a comment so I thought I'd house it here.

I should first off note I wrote my post back in the wake of a rejection so it was partly just a lashing out at the b-school process.

Anyway, to Axechick's points-

You say an MBA is for people who have made an impact somewhere and desire to continue making an impact throughout their careers. If a person was successfully making an impact before the MBA, and their goal is to continue doing so, why even bother getting the MBA? That sounds quite a lot like "getting a stamp". Practically speaking, if an MBA trains future world changers it should be accepting the people who have NOT already been making an impact to educate them how to do so. What an MBA really teaches you is how to run a business, with small portion aimed towards making you humane and want to give back to society.

You can be a stud analyst at some IB or Hedge fund to make your millions but do something outside of work to make an impact.

Very true. But do you need leadership to make a difference outside of work? You need leadership skills if you want to run some sort of organization or a team within one whose goal is to "make an impact", but couldn't you just volunteer to do charitable work and "make a impact"? I don't think one needs to be a leader to do that. It is more a question of character. Hell, just donating a million dollars to a charity will "make an impact", but that doesn't require leadership, just character (and money :-)).

If you want to stay in your current job and just be better at it, you don't need to go to a top MBA program.

Again, (most times) very true. But what if you don't want to stay in the same job? I think a huge percentage of people getting an MBA are not really doing it for skills as much as an opportunity to change their career. People may have ideas of what they'd like to do in the long term, but not necessarily what they'd like to do along the way. An MBA can educate about the variety of opportunities available in business and, most importantly, provide them an excellent method of getting the job they want through recuiting. If b-schools didn't have great recruiting, do you really think so many people would want to go?

Full-time MBA programs need leaders in school.

I am in no way saying schools should not have leaders for students. In fact, I believe I did say leadership was the best proxy for future success as a CEO and some other careers. I just said it wasn't right for everybody. I, too, would like to be around people who want to change the world. But that wouldn't be my main focus in choosing b-school classmates. I also want to be around people from a variety of professions who are the best at what they do so I can learn from them. You could be totally incompetant and "want to change the world." I'm all for making the world a better place and doing my part to make that happen, but if I wanted to devote my life to it I would have tried to hold a political office because (idealy) that's what it's there for (serving the people). First loyalty of a CEO is to the shareholders. Now, if you want to work for a non-profit that's a whole 'nother ballgame... I thought about the ways to change the world a while back and realized that the person who has a large impact on a few people's lives has done something as valuable as the person who has had a smaller impact on a large number of people's lives. I, personally, think I'm better at the former and have chosen that path, but that doesn't really come off on the application as demonstrating "leadership" as well as the latter. And what kind of leadership would it be? Leadership by example? Why do I get the impression this argument will all boil down to the definition of "leadership"...?

There are also several ways outside climbing the corporate ladder and starting your own business to show that you have leadership skills.

Again, very true. That's why I said I was exaggerating. I picked those because I think they stand out in the minds of the b-schools in the "professional" part of the application.

I think it is completely fair for any school who claims to educate LEADERS, to use that criteria to judge ALL applicants.

Of course. My point was that maybe they shouldn't only be looking to train leaders. And your point about HBS is well taken. And that's probably why HBS is not really a "finance" school the way Wharton is (I know I'm going to hear something about that comment). If you want to do finance at HBS or Stanford, you're probably looking to do private equity or venture, not something in "markets". And in PE/Venture, you probably want to have some managerial skills. Anyway, I think the finance students at HBS and Stanford are in the minority. As a corporate CEO, yes I think you have an opportunity to change the world in your profession. A top hedge fund manager... not so much. Outside of the profession, obviously either can. HBS can say it only wants students who will change the world because they can pick and choose whomever they want (for the most part). People who change the world are more visible and famous, etc., which looks great for the school. And by deciding to pick students who'll change the world (and work in business), they've effectively narrowed down the potential career goals of the students to those professions which allow for such kind of change. Guess that's why HBS is a top school for general management but not certain other fields.

But we shouldn't fault certain business schools for wanting and requiring that their students display [leadership and the desire to make an impact].

What do you mean "certain schools"? Don't you mean "every top school"? Every b-school app I read had some leadership related essay. If only "certain" (top) schools did it, I wouldn't have written the post!

Well, even if I'm completely wrong or completely missed the point, at least now there's an argument between bloggers to fill the void since the last one. Just kidding :-). There'll be no mud slinging from this blog.

Current State of Affairs

2005-04-22T17:06:00.000-04:00

While most of my fellow bloggers were at one admit weekend or another last weekend, I was in Florida for a company offsite. A good consolation I suppose. The offsite itself was good and all, but more importantly I found out just how much my company likes me.

The first night at the cocktail reception I was chatting with a small group of people including my boss's boss, the #2 guy in my company (my company employs more than 2,000 people, to give a little perspective). I'm pretty well known by senior management and the nature of my job is such that I have weekly to biweekly contact with him anyway, so chatting with him was really no big deal. What was a big deal though was when he said that since I wasn't going to b-school this year he had two jobs he thought I'd be interested in taking and that we needed to have a conversation about it at some point. Obviously my mind started thinking about all the possibilities and what I'd be willing to take. I decided it would have to be at least a two-level promotion for it to be anywhere near worthwhile as it would most likely not suit my career aspirations.

Fast forward two days, the big boss grabs me after lunch and we have the talk. We talk about what I want to do for the long term a little, then about the jobs themselves. Both are really high profile positions but are very administrative in nature. They are, however, two levels higher than my current position. I thought about it and neither would really be worth taking, so we get to talking about other stuff and he offers a third position in a different area but still within his "empire". Very different from the previous two and a really good job, but it's still not going down the career path I want to go down. The only positions that would be in my career path happen to be in another group that is not under him (it's under the other #2 in my company- one runs half the company and the other runs the other half with the CEO sitting above the two). So, he is less inclined to talk to me about those jobs as he sort of rivals the other #2 guy a bit and his goal is to keep me for himself in one form or another. Oh well. I tell him I'll think about it. Then we get back from the offsite and he stops by my office and offers me yet another job. This is craziness! Again, it's not something I really want to do, but it is also two levels higher than I am. During the offer he says something about an immediate promotion to one level higher, but it came out kind of mumbled and I just thought he meant it was part of that job. Couple minutes later my actual boss comes by and tells me I'm being promoted but because of budgeting it won't be in effect until July (my company pulls that kind of crap all the time, and is actually how I got my last promotion. If you're going to promote just do it- don't tease me with a two month wait). So, now I have four job offers and a promotion either way. And I'm going to give all this up to go to b-school! It would sure be nice if the b-schools decided to love me half as much as my company seems to.

My first Dirty Martini

2005-04-14T14:13:00.000-04:00

I have never had a dirty martini before. I'm really not much of a mixed drink drinker for that matter (I do love a good beer though). But, Tuesday night I had my first run in with a dirty martini when I met the ever famous blogger, Dirty Martini. Let me tell you, her blog is just the tip of the iceberg. She's quite the accomplished (former) applicant and is undoubtedly going to rule over a small piece of the financial world :-). It was great to meet her, talk about the whole b-school process and all the nonsense, and get her sagacious thoughts on the prospects of my reapp (oh, and DM, you flattered me far too much :-)). With the likes of DM leading the first year MBAs, Columbia will never be the same...

What is & What Should Never Be

2005-04-01T12:07:00.000-05:00

"You are too young."

At least someone gave it to me straight. I got dinged by Columbia. I was completely shocked when it happened. I thought for sure I was going to have to go there (explanation of what I mean in a future post). And I was very confused as to what more they could want from me. Then my dad was randomly talking to a family friend and he apparently has some connections with a higher-up at CBS and got him to look at my file (good to know for next year ;-) ). Feedback was that I was an outstanding candidate, but I was too young. Apparently, this year CBS has experienced a big rise in applications by "younger people" so they've been dinging most. I assume it would be similar for the other schools as well. My biggest dread was that I'd have to tell everyone at work that I didn't get in anywhere and they would be so disappointed because they think I'm some kind of a "golden boy" in my company. Especially since this girl in my sister group got into Wharton and she does far less important stuff than I do. But, now I can at least claim it's because I'm too young, whether or not that's really the reason (the girl's a year older than me). I have to try to save face because I'm going to need these people to write me rec's for next year and I'm going to try to finagle another promotion in the mean time. I guess I'll be scheduling a feedback session with Wharton in May to see what they think. I'm going to be running a few ideas by them as to what I should be doing to improve my candidacy for next year (I'll be posting my current front-running idea next week).

So this is it, I am now an MBA reapplicant for the class of 2008. I thought I could claim to be the first but it looks like Dave beat me to it. Well Dave, here's to us and the rest of the class of 2008 applicants. Congrats go out to all the others who got into their respective schools. Perhaps I'll be seeing you there next fall...

But the wind won’t blow,
You really shouldn’t go,
It only goes to show
That you will be mine
By takin’ our time...

(And no, this is not an April Fools joke)

A not so overwhelming sense of power

2005-03-31T00:30:00.000-05:00

So, last week I went to LA and Vegas to visit a friend and go to a bachelor party. I went to go visit that buddy of mine who moved out to LA for 6 months for a change of life and to see if his girlfriend was worth it, and then we and a couple others went to Vegas for his brother's bachelor party. I'm afraid the drinking and debauchery will have to remain classified for the protection of the innocent, but we did manage to go to a gun range.

I had always wanted to go to a gun range. Check it out, see what firing a gun was like. It was always described to me as a "rush of power". But, looking back on it, I don't remember ever feeling like that. It cost $50 to be able to fire any gun they had, which included four automatics, a slew of handguns, and, of course, the .44 magnum. The catch was that you only got 50 9mm bullets and could buy another 50 for $15. That and the magnum took a different caliber bullet. Since there were a bunch of us, two people got the magnum and the rest got automatics and we shared. Gotta say, it was a tremendous pain in the ass to load the clips. Taking each bullet by hand and pushing it into place almost made it not worth shooting. Almost. Firing the automatics was fun. I sprayed 20 bullets with no accuracy in about 5 seconds. It was over too quickly for me to have felt a rush. I used a couple other automatics, same effect. Then I tried the magnum. To be honest, I was scared of it. The sound that gun made was deafening. I kept picturing Policy Academy 4 with the grandma who gets thrown backward by the force of the magnum. But, in the end I did not get any air. Recoil was big, definitely hard to be accurate. The area on my palm near the thumb was sore. Felt too troubled by its power to feel like I had any. Time for something different, so I went with the glock. Type of gun some police use. No safety, a tad disconcerting. Very easy to fire, pat pat pat. But still, no feeling of power.

So is Redwolf destined to be a marksman one day? The lack of bullet holes on my target would indicate not. Fun time, but I did not leave with a need to own a gun. Perhaps the shotgun would have been different...

Really Long CBS Interview Autopsy

2005-03-16T19:16:00.000-05:00

All in all I think it went ok. Could have been better, could have been worse. It was definitely an atypical interview based on what I've read on the message boards. But the reasons are easy enough to understand...

I suppose I should start back when I scheduled the interview. That was about three weeks ago now. The first thing I did was try to research the three alums I was given as best I could to figure out what they do. One of them runs a hedge fund doing something really similar to what I do so I figured I had to interview with him. Not only would he understand what I do but also appreciate it for its relative difficulty. Or so I hoped. And at worst he'd be a good contact for a job one day :). Anyway, so when I called him up he basically was like "Uhh, what is this about? Oh yeah, I sort of remember signing up to do interviews. Hmm... What do I have to do exactly?" I was actually happy he responded this way because it meant he didn't really know the process and would probably be more informal, and probably would treat it more like a job interview than a b-school interview. Most of my strengths are in what I can do as an analyst rather than my past history with leadership. So that was good. The problem was that he wasn't available for two weeks. I had to make a decision quick on the phone and so I figured I was better off having the interview I wanted than getting my decision sooner.

Ok, fast forward two weeks. Get to his office, well rested, ready to go. Meet him, shake hands, etc. First thing he asks me is if there is some kind of form to fill out and if I could send it to him. So, that meant he never bothered to read the email Columbia sent him as to what to ask and how to act like an "ambassador" by promoting the school and being very nice and friendly (or at least that's what Clear Admit seemed to say). I told him Columbia sent it to him directly, and then he asked me to have them send it to him again. Great. Then he sits down and looks at my resume. First thing he asks is about my GMAT. "How does the scoring work again?" So then I tell him about the 800 max, 700-710 median at most schools, etc. Then he says he wants to start at the bottom and work our way up.

"Where do you play squash?"

"Well, I haven't played much lately because I used to play mainly with a guy from work who recently moved."

"Alright, so where do you play golf?"

"Well, I haven't played too much of that recently either, but mainly up where my parents live."

"Piece of advice, if you haven't done something recently don't put it on your resume. Why would you have something like poker here if you didn't really do it?"

And he comes out swinging! My mind started to scramble...

"Well, uh, I haven't really played much because it's winter now and, so, uh, I mean, I haven't played since the summer."

"Ok," he says semi-forgivingly.

That was pretty much how the whole thing went. He challenged me, I scrambled. He seemed to sort of buy whatever my explanation. By the end, I scrambled well though. After the questions about my "interests", he asked me about my activities section. Just had one club I listed from college I did a lot of work for and was treasurer of. After I explained all about it he tells me it's not really relevant for b-school. The treasurer part sort of is, but the budget (a number I had to pull out of my ass btw- who remembers the budget of a college club seven years ago?) was too small to be worthy. I tell him the reason I have it is because it was the activity I did the most work on and the club was founded my first year and by my fourth year we placed fifth in the national competition. "Ok, I guess that's something then." Then we start on my work experience.

"I see you worked at XYZ firm first."

"Well, I actually worked for ABC firm before that."

"Oh, really?! You should definitely have had that on your resume."

"Well, it is on my application. I only have a page to work with for the resume so I didn't have space for it."

"Some people have two pages for their resume. I know, I'll get a resume with two pages and think to myself, 'Who does this person think he is with two pages?' But then I'll read it and think it's actually ok."

Can you say ambiguous? Anyway, no major challenges for the rest of my work experience discussion. Then he says to me, "From what I see here, you don't need to go to business school. You're not going to really learn anything. Why do you even want to go? Is it just the network?" That was a curveball! I guess it's a complement, but man I was not expecting that. I obviously couldn't agree with him because otherwise I wouldn't get in! So I tell him about the type of job I want to get long term and short term and how I can only get the short term one out of b-school. He's not so satisfied with that. Then I tell him how I want to run my own fund one day, much like himself, and how there's more to running a fund than just research skills, etc. I add that the network is also really important in this business. He seems a little more satisfied with that. Then he says, "Why would you want to be in XYZ product when that market is at its peak now?" My mind scrambles again, but I make a good response which, thankfully, I happened to have randomly read a few days prior. "Ok, I can see that." Then I went on the offensive. "Well, why did you even go to business school then?" A little risky considering he could have said something like, "I was in marketing prior to b-school and used it to transition to finance," but he didn't. He took a step back and was like "Oh, well, I'm just giving you a hard time because I'm trying to figure out what you want to do, etc." Score one for Redwolf! Then he asks me why I think Columbia didn't just accept me straight out without an interview. I explain to him how everyone basically gets interviewed expect some reapps or some people in hard to reach places, etc. "Well, when I went I never got interviewed." I'm thinking to myself, well you graduated in the mid 90s. Back then the median GMAT was like 620! Then he adds, "I was in the law school at the time so I guess it's different..." You think?

At that point he basically ended the interview. My memory is a little vague on what exactly occurred, but I remember thinking it felt like the interview ended abruptly. I guess that meant he figured out all he needed to? Then he tells me to remind him to fill out the form when I send my thank you letter. My thought was, "Thank you letter, right..., forgot about that..." Then we get up, he shakes my hand, and says he thinks I'm a good candidate and if I get in we should keep in touch because he likes to know how "good people" are doing.

That certainly was not what I was expecting for an interview!

Couple days later he finds and submits my evaluation, and now I'm playing the waiting game. Good luck to everyone else in my shoes!

Allman Brothers

2005-03-15T15:02:00.000-05:00

Yesterday I went to see the Allman Brothers at the Beacon and it was awesome! My buddy got tickets from some broker his fund uses and we were in orchestra 8th row center. The band started really early (ie. on time) and rocked from the get go. A lot of stuff from their new album, but of course there were the classics. Set 2 had some amazing jams during Statesboro Blues and Liz Reed. The drum solos were great. And then they encored with a little Franklin's Tower (Grateful Dead) leading into You Don't Love Me. Derek Trucks is probably the best guitarist I've ever seen. If you're in NYC within the next week I highly recommend trying to get a ticket. Shows at the Beacon are always a good time :-).

My 2 cents

2005-03-07T13:40:00.000-05:00

On this whole HBS/ApplyYourself debacle, I can't believe this has actually escalated to the point that this is an actual "issue". Who cares if they checked their app status early? I always thought these b-schools wanted the most innovative, creative, and determined people out there. These are the people who are going to do whatever it takes, without breaking the rules, to succeed. How can b-schools not expect this of their candidates? It's not like any school said it is against the rules to check their application status early. They should have had the foresight (like any good manager would have) and prevented this. A simple "it would be unethical to attempt to determine your status early" would do. And when dealing with something as simple as an application process we should not be sitting there trying to interpret what it means not to do anything "unethical". There is no supreme court to clarify ambiguities in the application rules. Ultimately, these were people checking out info about themselves before the rest. Did they attempt to change their status? I'm guessing most didn't. Those that did... sorry, you fucked up. But the rest, they were just trying to get ahead without breaking the rules. When the market is trading and you see a mispricing, do you say "Oh, I should call the market maker and tell him he's making an error"? No, you buy or sell the shit out of it. It's the competitive spirit while playing within the rules. This isn't touchy-feely school we're going to. It's business school. This is the way the business environment is. Competition is the foundation of our economy. Are your going to punish the invisible hand that copied and pasted the link?

Of course, the funny thing is the guy who came up with this "innovation" was smart enough to figure out how to do it, but dumb enough to think that if he posted it on the businessweek message board the school wouldn't get wind of it and attempt some form of punishment. Yeah, I know I just said I can't believe this is an issue and am now saying how could the guy not know it would be, but that's just the way things are. Things you believe are non-issues always seem to become issues. And stupid ones at that.

This is a top corporate manager?

2005-03-01T12:30:00.000-05:00

I was reading Aregon's blog today, came across a link to this post on the "Field Guide for the Aspiring MBA" blog. Funny stuff. But what was most hilarious was a link posted on that site. It's on one of those pro-Macintosh websites ready to trash Microsoft at a moment's notice, but that doesn't prevent the fact that Balmer made an ass of himself. I am generally "pro" Microsoft from a business standpoint (naturally), but seeing one of their leaders dance around like that is a tad disturbing. I wonder how an adcom would react if I said I wanted to be like Steve Balmer and then showed them this :-). Shouting "Come on, give it up for me!!!!"? Come on.

Two women want me at the same time...

2005-02-24T12:07:00.000-05:00

So there's good news and bad news to this story. The bad news is this is not every guy's fantasy come true. The good news is that I got an interview with Columbia!!! Got the letter from Nancy Schauf and Michelle Stockman telling me they'd like me to meet with one of their "Ambassadors". I was really surprised to find the email in my inbox because it came only about a week after my application went "under review". Everything I'd been reading on the message boards seemed to indicate it'd take much longer. So, naturally I'm trying to read something into this like any neurotic b-school applicant. The likely situation is that the first reader decided to call me in for the interview before the others had read it. I highly doubt more than one person got to it so quickly. Either that or my application went "under review" earlier than they told me. One of the three Ambassadors they've given me to choose from does almost exactly what my long term career goal is so I'm going to try to interview with her because I think she'll have a greater appreciation for what I do now and how an MBA will help me with my goals. But I haven't got the call back so it might not work out. We'll just have to see...

Well, it may not be every guy's fantasy but I'll certainly take it :-)! Good luck to all those that are still waiting.

O Blogger, Blogger! Wherefore art thou Blogger?

2005-02-17T15:45:00.000-05:00

It seems like there has been a substantial lack of blogging lately by those in the "blogs I read" section. There are some who are always blogging without fail, but most these days don't seem to be sharing their recent thoughts and experiences as often as they used to. And who am I to talk? I haven't blogged in any way that could be described as "frequently". As a blog reader, I very much enjoy having something worth looking at on the internet to distract me from the day-to-day toils of corporate finance, so I thought I should be motivated enough to provide something to all those souls out there who have nothing better to do than read my meager little blog even though I have nothing of any significance to say at the moment.

Actually, I did just get a call from a headhunter today telling me something like she "only works with people with my kind of background", and she started to describe some positions she had available. It only made it all too clear that b-school really is the best direction for me at the moment. Obviously there are better things out there, but given where I am and what that implies in terms of probable positions I could get, I am best off playing the "start-over card" that is the full-time MBA and start down the path I really want to be on. Part of my career goals straight out of college was to never have to do an MBA. I always thought its best value was as a way to essentially reset your resume so that you could get a job completely different than what you're currently doing. And since it was only something you could do once, you really had to make it count. At times I ask myself if I'm really in that position now, but after hearing the current opportunities the headhunter had to tell me about and hearing about the type of offers my friend at Chicago GSB is getting for the summer, I'm pretty sure the time has come. So, if I don't get in to Columbia this year, a re-applicant I shall be...

Touché Wakechick...

2005-02-09T12:47:00.000-05:00

Wakechick has made an excellent comment in regards to my previous post on my thoughts about the b-school process. Let me say "thanks" to Wakechick here before I forget. Anyway, she felt that my idea that people should say they want to be C_O of a company, etc. is not right. And, after some reflection, I realized she is right. The fundamental flaw with this idea is the presumption that anyone can write a convincing essay about something they do not necessarily believe in. It is not realistic to presume that if you want to, say, run division X of company Y in the long run that you'd be able to articulate clearly and effectively reasons you'd want to be CEO instead.

"I also think it's extremely important to be yourself and be completely honest." - Wakechick

This quote, in a way, supports what I'm saying because most people write their best when they're being honest about how they feel. If someone could convincingly write lies about how they feel, it is akin to the talent an actor possesses, just expressed through the pen (or keyboard). This is clearly not a skill everyone possesses. So, if you do wish to venture down this avenue because you think it'll be better received by the adcom, be sure that the essay will actually be as good as you think it'll be. Better writing is often better than better words.

The second point Wakechick makes is equally valid. If you write an essay about wanting to be C_O just like everyone else, you won't be able to distinguish yourself from the pack. The logic is sound, but, to be honest, I have no idea if that is necessarily a good thing. I am undecided, but I'd like to throw out two thoughts. When I went to some school's info session one of the adcom members made a point that trying to write a "different" essay was kind of a waste of time. She said she and the others have read so many different essays before that nothing you're going to say is really all that "different" or "new". So I think in general trying to distinguish yourself with one point is an extremely difficult task. And since b-school applicants have long term career goals that do not vary that much, I think you'll always be in the same category as a ton of other applicants no matter what you say you want to do. What makes a single applicant unique is the some of all his or her parts, so having some things that are the same as others is not necessarily bad.

The second observation I'll make is a general comment about b-schools as well. Every adcom says they want to add diversity to their class. It is one of the most important points to them. A diverse class is useful because it allows for different thought processes to go on which will bring about different ideas and conclusions, thus enriching others by seeing the world through another's eyes. I think this is very important to the learning experience. But at the same time, every school has a "fit". Schools will not accept you even though you are an outstanding candidate just because you don't "fit". This is typically used as the explanation for why someone doesn't get into Harvard but does get into Stanford. Even I saw myself as "fitting" into Wharton much better than Stanford or Harvard back in round 1. So, if schools are truely seeking a "diverse" class, doesn't having a "fit" seem like an oxymoron? I'm sure someone can come up with a great explanation as to how "diversity" and "fit" can co-exist in b-school, but I think b-schools may be missing out on the true benefits of diversification. Now, some may argue that being too diverse will lead to anarchy in the classroom and prevent progress from being made on a given topic, but I think the real reason b-schools don't want to "diversify" their class that much is that they ultimately want all their graduates to be similar. There are definite stereotypes that accompany any HBS, GSB, Tuck, Wharton, etc. graduate, and most of the good ones (and some of the bad ones) are based around the "fit". If all the admits conform to a certain "fit", then the "diversity" is probably best measured by each candidate's life experiences, not by the way they think, which defeats the key benefit to diversification. I'd love to see the progess made by putting a graduate from each school into a classroom and just letting it go. The process would be long, but I'm sure the result could be great (assuming the whole anarchy thing doesn't set in). I'm sure each school has an idea as to the way to train the future leaders of the world, and since they only have two years to do it they want someone who already conforms to the process from the start and will have a much easier time accepting their method of education. And if this is the case, then if you want to get into a specific school I think you might have to tailor your experiences and goals to conform to their fit, unless you already happen to be that way. Fortunately, most schools' fits are fairly broad allowing the opportunity to be just one person (hopefully yourself) and get into multiple schools. I think this logic could be applied to the way discuss your leadership experiences as well.

It seems this post could have been called "Thoughts, Part 2" or something (sorry if it's also too long), but I only really came up with them after reading Wakechick's comments so, again, much thanks to her. And I apologize if I've misconstrued your meaning or twisted your words.

Some of my thoughts on the B-school application process

2005-02-07T14:03:00.000-05:00

Before I go into this, keep in mind that these are just my opinions about the process and do not necessarily represent fact. I'm sure my description is full of inaccuracies, but this is just my best guess as to what it really is and my opinions on that based upon my experience thus far.

Getting into business school is rather unique when compared to other graduate level eductional programs. From what I understand, getting into law school, for example, is dependent primarily upon your LSAT and your undergrad GPA. Essays and experience are secondary conerns. I would imagine many, if not most, graduate level programs are similar in cases where there is some form of standardized test relevant to the program. If the graduate program only has the GRE to rely upon for a universal method of comparison, the admissions board may not lend much credence to it if the skills required to perform well on the test are not really relevant for success in the program. Anyway, business school is unique because it has a standardized test specifically designed for it, the GMAT, yet the GMAT is not a primary factor in the admission decision making process. I'm sure many people think it is, but my experience with the application process has indicated that it is not. It is, however, a strong secondary factor. The GMAT functions primarily as a simple "yes, no, or maybe" tool to see if you can handle the "academic rigour", but also serves as a minor indicator of what I'll term "potential intelligence". If you score greater than 700 (with >=80% in both verbal and quant), it's a "yes", between 600 and 700, "maybe", and less than 600, "no" (this is an oversimplication of the process and the numbers cited are just approximates. The "true" method is more complex in the below 700 range, which accounts for people with scores in the 400s getting into a school like Stanford). Anyway, basically if you "pass" the GMAT test then it becomes all about your essays and work experience. Really, no matter your GMAT scores it's all about your essays and work experience, but if you "pass" the GMAT test you don't have to be as exceptional as you would if you "did not pass" (note that you don't really "fail" the GMAT test. You just don't "pass"). However, schools will give a candidate with a 800 a bit more credit than a candidate with a 710 because of the "potential intelligence" factor. I don't think this credit is very significant though. So, basically, the higher the GMAT the better up to a point. After 700, there are diminishing returns up to about 750 where it's becomes hard to distinguish.

So, a candidate with an 800 on the GMAT does not have as good a shot of getting into business school as a candidate with a 45 on the MCAT does of getting into medical school. Clearly, MBA admissions committees do not view the GMAT as the universal measure of a candidate's suitability for their program. The presumption we must make about any graduate program is that they want their graduates to succeed at their endevours (see my previous post in relation to this topic). Most likely, if a student goes to a graduate school to learn to be a doctor, that is the endevour they will most likely follow. If he or she were instead to go and build a company or become a professional athlete, as long as he or she was successful at it I'm sure his or her school would be happy with it. But as the admissions committees cannot usually know what a candidate is going to do after graduation, they must assume that it will be something related to the program they are applying to because that is what most of their graduates do. So, the MBA adcom is looking for candidates who will succeed in business (I know, you could have told me that without even thinking. Apologies for my need to do semi-formal proofs).

So then the MBA adcom must ask itself, "what makes for a successful business person?", to which they have decided "leadership" as the prime factor, and perhaps "analytical ability" as the second factor. Analytical ability is partly measured by the GMAT, so the essays can be mainly used to judge leadership and one's intended path towards success. Now, the question becomes whether leadership is in fact the best proxy for success in business. I think if your goal is to become an corporate executive or MD, then yes, leadership probably is. The key is to remember that "leadership" encompasses more than just the desire to be the guy that runs the show. It also covers your ability to organize, execute, etc. But, as I mentioned in that other post, I do not think leadership is necessarily the best proxy for all forms of business success. I believe that not everyone can nor wants to be a manager or executive, but does want a career in business whose success will depend primarily upon aptitude (I will not expound upon that here though). And as the system might require an MBA to proceed towards that person's goal, said person must write a bunch of bullshit about how great a leader he or she is in order to tell the adcoms what they want to hear because otherwise he or she probably won't get in just by non-leadership based merit or ability alone. (And if you're wondering, no I did not do this and am just being sour. I just wrote honestly about what I wanted to do and why I thought I was a good candidate, which may or may not include being a CEO in XYZ industry.)

I've strayed a bit from the topic. Basically what I've figured out is that your essays and work experience mean everything. Nothing new. But what I can tell you are some things to and not to write if your concern is just about getting in. Some other blogs written by applicants admitted into top programs have done this, but I thought a perspective from someone who has been dinged by top programs might be useful. First, don't write a long term career goal that doesn't involve being a manager of some sorts. In fact, don't aspire to anything less than an executive or owner of a business. Say you want to be C_O (fill in the blank) or you want to run your own hedge fund or private equity shop. You might even be able to get away with saying MD of this or that group, but I think it would look better in the adcom's eyes to say your want to run your own shop that does "this or that". No one actually expects that you'll definitely do whatever it is you say. A ton of people change their minds about their careers just after entering school! Also, you must state some sort of short term career goal that is a natural step towards attaining that long term goal and demonstrate that you can't attain either goal without the MBA. For example, get a job in PE so you can one day run your own PE shop, but you work in IT so you need the skills only an MBA can offer to make the career transition. Something like that. And be explicit because it's not necessarily so that the person reading your app will know anything about what it's like to get a job in XYZ industry. I know I did not do a good job explaining why I couldn't just get the job I wanted without the MBA after I described it and what I currently do to a consultant friend and he thought it shouldn't be hard to get the job without the MBA based solely upon what he knows. If he didn't know about some of the intricacies of careers in finance, why would the adcom necessarily? I'm sure there are people that just lie and customize their "short and long term goals" to be whatever will most necessitate an MBA and look most appealing to the adcom. They'll do something like say they want to be CEO of a great charitable non-profit when in fact they're just some cocky finance kid who's only in it for the money. I, personally, hate that fuckers like that get in to b-school shafting the honest folks out there and cannot in any way condone such actions. But I suppose that's a lesson to be learned in the business world. Anyway, that covers the "intended path towards success" part of the essays, but the same concepts can be applied to the "leadership" part. Be explicit. Don't just assume that if you write about how you ran this group or came up with this great thing that made your company lots o' $$ that the adcom will see it as "leadership". You should explicitly say "I demonstrated leadership by running this group, etc" and then talk about how that act actually does in fact demonstrate leadership. You're better off talking less about the details of the event than describing how it shows you're a great leader. And if you developed some great new product for your company or something then don't just write about that and how great a success it was, you have to explicitly draw out the link to how this means you're a great leader. And honestly, I doubt there'll always be a link. But if there's not, then you have to think harder and come up with something. You just got to keep drilling it into the adcom's heads that you are a leader and that you'll be successful. Of course, some actions are hard to mistake for anything but clear proxies for future business success and general leadership, such as starting your own company or organization. Though, if I were an adcom member having to read my share of 5,000+ applications, I probably wouldn't spend a ton of time thinking about how this or that might indicate leadership. If it's clearly laid out for me, it makes it much easier.

Since the primary factor used to determine a candidate's potential admission to a school is determined entirely by the candidate, it's clear that this system can be gamed. The GMAT and your GPA are determined by others and are meant to reflect some of your abilities. The recommendations, assuming you do not "influence" them, have the same property. But, your essays are (theoretically) written entirely by you about you, and you can say whatever you want. So, it is relatively easy for a candidate to make his or her application seem better than what he or she truly is if he or she writes the right things in his or her essays. Of course, some actions are hard to mistake for anything but clear proxies for future business success and general leadership, such as starting your own company or organization. Assuming you have a certain level of aptitude as measured by the GMAT and GPA, it's possible for anyone to get in to the most desirable of business schools. It's just a matter of how well you can paint yourself to fit the colors of each business school. I don't think other graduate programs offer this "opportunity". It would appear intelligence is not the deciding factor for admittance to an MBA program (although one could argue that the "intelligent" people are the ones who are smart enough to write essays that will get them into b-school). Some actions, like starting your own business, will speak for themselves, but many will not. Your fate is entirely up to you and how well you can spin the details of your life to fit those of the "ideal candidate". Perhaps those with a political background would fair very well with the adcoms...

I'm Back

2005-02-02T12:38:00.000-05:00

So, I've been in India for the past two weeks or so visiting family. It seems all of my relatives there have become super religious. As an Indian born and raised in NY in a 90%+ white town with little contact with "my" religion and culture, this was somewhat intriguing to me. My mother is now pretty much non-Indian. My father has done daily poojas (basically Hindu prayers/rituals) his entire life, yet somehow managed to forget including either my sister or myself in the process while in the US. From an intellectual standpoint I doubt the existence of "God" as commonly believed by man. I believe something created man, or perhaps life in general, and this entity can be characterized as "God", but as for the all-knowing or all-powerful stuff or that he/she/it needs to be worshipped, not so sure. In India I am expected to participate in poojas 100%, which typically involves me sitting there like an idiot for 3 hours not knowing what's going on and thinking things like "I wonder if God is going to damn me for this basic heresy...." I can't just not participate either because it means so much to my relatives and I'd hate to disappoint them on something that is so important to them. And considering that I'd just be sleeping or watching tv otherwise, I think I can manage the sacrifice. If Hinduism is "right", I'll at least be doing something man is supposed to.

Anyway, it's good to be back. The parting gift of "backdoor trots" India gave me was, well, let's just say sentimental, but I would have been happy to have gone without it. But, coming back also meant I had to deal with checking on my decisions from HBS and Stanford. As I had not been interviewed by either, I knew I was going to be rejected. I had slight hope for waitlist, but the odds on that are so tiny it wasn't even worth considering. So, I decided to just not check while I was away as it would only lead to having to think about what I was going to do if I didn't even get into Columbia. I did check after I landed back in NY, and yes, I was rejected from both. This whole process made me realize I did not put out the strongest application I could. Actually, that's not right. What I should say is that I did not put out the best application suited towards getting me in. But I will expound on that in a post full of complete honesty about my opinions on this process tomorrow. Congrats to all on their acceptances while I was away.

It's that time of year again...

2005-01-16T01:23:00.000-05:00

Not talking about MLK weekend, and, sorry, Christmas has already passed. That's right, time to start studying for the CFA again!!! Five months of studying and going to work. Can't think of any better way to spend my time :). At least this will be the last year of it (hopefully)!

I'm filled with disappointment now as the Jets lost today. What a huge let down that was. Everyone at the bar I was at was so crushed after having come so close. And then the Rams lost too, which normally I wouldn't care about but I had bet on the game. It's ok though. This may be my last post for a while as I'm off to India Monday to visit some family. Should be a nice break from work, and when I get the news from H/S at least I'll be on vacation. Good luck to all, and an early congrats on any admits I'll miss!

What does leadership matter anyway?

2005-01-13T12:20:00.000-05:00

Yeah, that's right. I said it. What does leadership matter anyway? I've been giving this a good deal of thought and I think the search for "leadership" in ALL MBA candidates is outdated. Allow me to explain.

MBA- Masters in Business Administration. The schools that offer it- "Business Schools" or "Schools of Management". The MBA program was designed to teach its students the fundamentals of how to properly run a business (or at least I think that's it). The idea was to take someone with natural leadership ability and give him/her the structural and organizational skills necessary to be an effective manager (and of course general business knowledge). While this is still the idea for many attending business school, I don't think it's universal to all students or applicants.

I think a business school ultimately has the following goals-

1) To provide the best education it can to its students
2) To select applicants that are the most likely to succeed (at their endevours?)
3) To maintain or improve its reputation (which is done by having quality academics and producing successful graduates)

I've probably missed some things, but this covers what's necessary for my argument. Anyway, my argument gets at #2. I put the "at their endevours" in parentheses with a question mark because it's not really clear if a business school wants its students to just be successful at whatever they try to do, or to be "successful" according to some predetermined notion it has. I think it's more the latter than the former. HBS asks you to define "success" in their application, but I don't think "Making enough money to retire" will really fly with them (that's the goal of most traders, for example, including the "successful" ones). The b-schools all want super-ambitious go-getters, whatever that means. And if you haven't demonstrated leadership by doing things like starting your own company or trying to climb the corporate ladder as quick as possible, you probably won't cut the mustard (exagerating a bit, but you get the idea). Anyway, what I think the b-schools are missing is that this is not the best way to judge ALL its applicants. I agree that if the applicant wants to become a CEO or other corporate executive one day, leadership is a very necessary skill/trait. But not every graduate can be an executive, nor does he/she want to be. Since so many of the applicants are pursuing a career in financial services these days, which I believe does not require leadership to be successful in (there are others that this argument applies to as well), the traits b-schools are looking for should be more tailored to the industry the applicant intends to pursue a career in and not just follow that party line, "leadership, leadership, leadership".

Take, for example, one school's Full Time Career Management stats (apologies for the difficult to read format)-

Consulting/Strategy 28.0%
Control/Accounting 0.6%
Corporate Finance/Mergers & Aquisitions 21.7%
Entrepreneurial Management 0.8%
General/Project Management/Management Rotation Programs 9.8%
Investment Management/Portfolio Management 9.3%
Operations/Production Management 1.5%
Product/Brand Marketing 9.7%
Product Development/Structuring 1.3%
Research 2.1%
Risk Management 0.8%
Sales 2.6%
Trading 2.3%
Other 7.9%
Not Specified 1.6%

I would say that the IM/PM, Research, RM, Sales, and Trading professions are probably filled with people that don't want to be a CEO. That's 17.1%, and probably a conservative number. Realistically, I think most of these people have gone to business school in order to either change career paths or their companies gave them the boot before. I don't think their ambition is to run a company one day. There is a huge difference between wanting to be a top performer in the industry and being a successful manager of the group. I work at a financial research firm, and there are many star analysts who were made MDs only to find that they don't enjoy being a manager and would rather just be a great analyst. I don't think any b-school would look down on an alum who was a star analyst because he/she didn't want to be a manager, do you? So then why should you as an applicant be judged based on your ability to be a great manager one day?

So, what is going to make a person successful in one of these industries? I think either one of two things- hard work or talent. I don't think being a great leader is going to make you a successful trader, for example. And if that's what you want to do, why should you be judged on your history of leadership? So then assuming b-schools know this and use leadership anyway, the question becomes, what is leadership proxying for in these cases? My guess is ambition or drive. People with ambition and drive are likely to be successful at what they do just because they want it bad enough to keep trying all the time. I think that's inefficient. If hard work and talent are the two things that'll make one successful in these industries, you have to try to measure a person's abilities at both of these. Talent is hard to measure, obviously. Natural charisma is often linked to being a good Sales person (ie talent), but there's no way to measure it on an application. GMATs serve as a very weak proxy for talent in general. The resume and recommendations are probably the best way to identify it. Hard work is easier to measure though. That's much more evident in the resume and recommendations. With those items I believe one can fairly accurately determine if someone is hard working.

So back to goal #2. Leadership is not going to be the best proxy for future success in many fields. So to judge all applicants on it seems stupid to me. If the goal of a business school is only to produce future corporate executives, then fine, judge by leadership. But if the goal is to produce successful professionals, then leadership should not always be stressed. This is where the "at their endevours" part comes into play. For those career paths that don't require strong leadership, add on "at their endevours" to goal #2 and judge. Don't force candidates in or pursuing career paths that provide little opportunity to demonstrate "leadership" to have to tie their successes to it in some nonsensical way. "By completing a huge deal in a record amount of time that made my firm lots of $$ I demonstrated leadership by, uh..., uh..., setting a great example for others." The sentence should have ended at $$ and THAT would have been a good proxy for "success". If you want to be a trader upon graduation, your ability to work in a team or group is really useless. It will not make you successful. Your ability to analyze data and predict movements in the market will. And if the longer term goal is to become a portfolio manager, then you'll need those managerial skills you learned at b-school. But leadership? It's not like you have a vision for where the market is going and lead your team to make it happen. It's more like the team tells you what their research shows and you make a decision and have the traders execute. What'll inspire the team is if you're right and make money.

So, to all those b-schools out there, if you're going to offer career services (and therefore encouragement) to students who choose a career path that doesn't require leadership skills to succeed in, don't pick those students based on their history of demonstrating leadership. Make the adcom a more specialized force. Have current students who want to be/previously were consultants or adcom members that know about consulting read the applications of those who say they want to be consultants after graduation. Likewise for traders, PMs, entrepreneurs, I-bankers, etc. They'll know better what it really takes to be successful in their field. Don't just be generic and say "leadership". It may slow down the process a bit because you'll have to sort applications by job preference, but I'm sure it'll lead to less admissions mistakes (both type I and type II error).

Note: I wrote this thing back over Christmas break, and then completely forgot about it. I think I still believe it.

Crazy, yes. But not for that reason...

2005-01-11T05:32:00.000-05:00

So it would appear my post yesterday went unrecognized. Not surprised, kind of obscure. I went to The Back Fence last week, heard this song (sorry it's only a cover of the Guns 'N Roses original), and have had it stuck in my head since. Patience seemed to be a good theme for now.

Ok, I'm off to Canada this morning to help sell the model I built. Here's a special "hello" to all our friends up North!

Patience

2005-01-10T13:40:00.000-05:00

Lately I've been walking the streets at night. Just thinking about how to get my last essays right. It's hard to see straight with so many decisions coming 'round. Trying to logon decision day will be like being stuck in a crowd. And the schools don't change much, maybe just the name. Startin to think I don't have time for this game. Acceptance letter, I think I need you. Yeah, well, I guess I really need you. Ooh, just this one time....

Beginning to smell a lot like Christmas

2005-01-07T14:03:00.000-05:00

Christmas was in the air this morning. Or should I say, Christmas trees. It would appear that people are starting to dispose of their Christmas trees in NYC. That and it's bulk pickup day for my block. You could smell the trees in the air, which was much nicer than the typical odors one finds on trash day. It brought me back to the holidays, the time when I had stopped stressing about b-school in order to enjoy the season. I hate to think of the fate of those magic trees. And it's especially twisted that I had just been thinking about that Ren and Stimpy song earlier in the morning as I was putting on my coat to go out the door...

What rolls down stairs,
and over the chairs,
and into your neighbor's dog?
It fits on your back,
it's good for a snack,
everyone knows it's log.

It's log, it's log,
it's big, it's heavy, it's wood.
It's log, it's log,
it's better than bad, it's good!

It's Columbia Time, baby

2005-01-06T15:07:00.000-05:00

Finally decided to get my shit together and apply to Columbia. The whole rolling decision thing has not motivated me to be prompt and quick about it even though I know most people are going to apply by the 10th. But now it's time. The essays don't seem too bad. I think I've written stuff for the other apps that'll cover everything for this one, with a touch of the old magic wand. I love NY, but I really want to get away from it for a while so I'm not sure how I feel about going if I were to get in. We'll just have to see...

Inspiration, look see.

2005-01-05T14:07:00.000-05:00

I've been inspired. A couple times over the course of 24 hours. Today, I was inspired by Classy's post, which lead me to discover the blog of Zach. I feel like the last couple posts of mine having been of a negative nature, so time for some positivity!

Prior to that, I was inspired by my friend, "M" (cheers to Classy for the naming convention). "M" has decided to just pick up and go to LA for 6 months. He was involved in this twisted love triangle, or I should say quadrangle, that ended up with him getting a girlfriend in LA and being friends with all the other participates. Houdini, I challenge thee. Now, "M" is a rather lazy guy. He went to visit his aunt in Budapest a while back and since then has "talked" about moving there. But we all knew it was just talk. He'd never get his shit together enough to actually do it. But he really just wanted to get out of NY and do something different. Most of the time that he was in the new relationship, he wanted to get out. He basically was like, "she's in LA, it'll never work. I'm not into this long-distance crap." I thought that was rather foolish given his track record in NY. So, it came as quite a shock to me couple months back to hear him say he was going to move to LA. We all figured this was going to go the way of the Budapest move- nowhere. But low and behold he's flying out tomorrow. Good for him. He's one of my best friends, so it'll suck to lose him, but I hope he finds some happiness out there.

As I was out with him and some others last night talking about how crazy it is that he's actually doing this and how sweet his new house is ($1500 for a furnished house on the beach with all utilities and such included), I got to thinking. I thought about my prospects for b-school this year, and what I'll do if I don't get in/decide not to go. I need to work until August so my 401K will vest. I could keep working at my job after. Blah! I could get a new job. Eh. Or maybe, just maybe, I could pick up and go somewhere, anywhere, and see what life has to offer, and then reapply to b-school. I've been trying to write for a while now, but haven't had much success with it because of time constraints. Half the year, my free time has been zapped by the CFA exams. But this will hopefully be my last year of that. I'm tired of living in the cold come winter too. And working in general. I need a break. Perhaps I could just work through the end of the year, get my bonus, and then take off somewhere. But part of the idea of doing something like this is to write about it in the b-school apps. So much uncertainty! I'm going to India this month to visit the fam and with any luck I'll get some guidance from someone enlightened there.

"Happiness, no more be sad, happiness....I'm glad."

Thank you.

Happy New Year

2005-01-01T01:05:00.000-05:00

Been out of touch this last week. I didn't actually go on vacation, but I decided to just be on vacation anyway. I went to work, and did next to nothing. Nobody was there. Everyone was on vacation, and I didn't have anything really worth doing. So, I ripped all my CDs to .ogg format to go on my new mp3 player. I went with Ogg Vorbis because it's supposed to be a better encoder than LAME and getting as small files as possible was a necessity (don't worry if you have no idea what I'm talking about). Anyway, I also decided to go on vacation from blogging. But tonight I find myself off of vacation, even though I'm now on a trip.

It's New Year's Eve. I prefer to go to apartment/house parties rather than bars/clubs for New Year's. I have equally as good a time, but for significantly less cost. Most bars in NY charge between $75-$150 to get in. "All you can drink", but not really. Anyway, my buddy in Chicago asked me to come out to visit a month ago but I hesitated to decide. At the time I wasn't sure what was going on in NY, so I just said maybe. After I got the Wharton reject I was a little down, and since my friends in NY were doing nothing that appealed to me I decided to just go to Chicago. Found a ticket for less than $300, got here today (or I guess yesterday technically). I had gone out drinking the night before (btw saw an awesome Doors cover band at the Red Lion) and woke up dehydrated and tired. Got myself together, made it to the airport, got a couple slices of pizza, and boarded. After I got to Chicago, I met my buddy's parents. They have an apartment in the same building as him and are in town for New Years with the rest of the family. They came over for cocktails since we weren't going to be able to go to dinner with them. At this point, around 5pm, I was hungry but only had some crackers and cheese available. We finally left around 7:30pm (8:30pm NY time). My hunger was temporarily masked after the crackers, but I was definitely undernourished and so developed a headache. This was not an unusual reaction for me to such conditions, and I knew I just needed food.

We were supposed to go to a party in Wicker Park, so my buddy said we'd eat up there. But, he wanted to go cheap and take the subway, which sucks in Chicago. My head was displeased. The subway was free for New Year's though, so at least there was that. On the train some guy that was probably homeless sat in front of us. He smelled revolting. First headache, then noxious fumes. Great. Finally got to Wicker Park at 8:30pm, which was really 9:30pm as far as my body was concerned. My friend said we should go to this noodle place, but I quickly vetoed that saying I need a hearty meal of Italian. I know, noodles, pasta- same thing. But Italian food always sits heavier for me because of the cheese, I guess. We spotted a place that said "ristorante", I saw spinach ravioli on the menu, done! Ordered the food and a sprite. The waiter sucked. Took forever to bring the sprite. At that point I was in bad shape. The sprite and bread helped a little. Bathroom seemed to be calling out to me. Upon completion, I felt weak. It was like I just expelled any food or energy my body had had in it. The pasta was on the table when I got back. Ate about two and a half raviolis over the span of about 15 mintues. The pasta was so so, but I was not even that good. Have you ever gotten really drunk, woke up the next morning shaking, hungry, but your stomach feels nauseous so you can't really eat anything? That's what I felt like. It's all dehydration, I think. I knew that was it for the night. I told my friend I needed to go to a supermarket, get a can of soup, get some advil, and go back to his place. Asked the waiter where the nearest supermarket was, and my buddy and I took off. As the waiter sucked at his job, naturally he had to suck at directions too. Such was the way the night was shaping up. Luckily a Walgreens was along the way and I got what I needed. Took my friend's keys, told him to go to the party and not come back with me, and left. Came back to the apartment, cooked the soup with lots of extra salt, took an advil, and now I'm feeling ok. It's now 12:01am in Chicago. I'm feeling tired enough not to bother going to the party, especially since my friend called and said it's pretty tame. Instead, I'm sharing my New Year's story with you all. For some reason, I don't really think I mind though. As far as I'm concerned, good or bad it's just another day on the calendar. All I really care about now is figuring out what I'm going to do with myself this year if I don't get in to b-school.

Anyway, I hope you enjoyed your New Year's. Feel free to share any interesting stories.

Happy Festivus!

2004-12-23T13:48:00.000-05:00

A Festivus for the rest of us! I think it's fitting since I'm neither Christian nor Jewish, and yet my family celebrates both Christmas and Hannukah (long twisted story, perhaps for another post...). Hope all enjoy this holiday time, even if it's not your holiday.

The Day After

2004-12-22T19:36:00.000-05:00

Wharton rejection was a big disappointment. The path my life has taken thus far has made it very clear to me that, when it comes to important stuff that I have no control over, I will never get exactly what I want. I am very often given #2 or #3, but never #1. But I am very rarely given the very worst option, so I am content with that arrangement. When it came time to apply to b-school, part of my decision not to apply to U of C GSB was because I thought it would be tempting fate. The U of C is a superior school that many would be thrilled to attend, but I have some personal reasons which keep me from wishing to do so. The school would be really good but not preferred, and so a clear "#2". I had thought about it as a backup after what my interviewer said, but later decided that I would only apply to schools I would really want to go to so as to "game the system", so to speak. If you don't give fate the option to disappoint, it can't. So, even when I didn't get the "top tier" choices for me, I would still be happy to go to the "second tier" and not just be making a selection that would be long run good for my career. College sucked, time to enjoy myself. Anyway, of the three I applied to, Wharton was my last choice. But it was such a fantastic "last choice" to have! After visiting it, I thought for sure it was my "destiny" to go there. Seemed like a perfect fit. But now that I've been rejected, I'm not really sure what's going to go down. Fate found the one hole in my plan (a big hole, I know).

After college I made the decision I would do everything I could to avoid going to b-school because of the costs, $ and opportunity. For the line of work I was looking to do, it was unnecessary. But, I am no longer in that line of work and I can't get back directly. Need a stepping stone- either b-school or another job. Given the Wharton reject and the slim chances now at HBS and Stanford (there's really only about a week and a half for Stanford to send an invite and two and a half for HBS), I'm re-evaluating the whole thing. Of course, with the holidays now I can't really figure anything out until people start working again in January. So I find myself back to playing the waiting game, which sucks.

Disappointed about Wharton? Yes. Bothered by it? No. My life always works out ok. Not great, but ok.

Ding!

2004-12-21T10:02:00.000-05:00

Wow, it only took 3 posts to get a ding. Wharton man, I thought we were friends dude? What's up with that? Oh well...

Catch Up

2004-12-19T19:56:00.000-05:00

For my first real post I should probably play a bit of catch up to inform all those eager readers of my humble MBA-related beginnings. I work in finance in NYC. I decided to pursue an MBA some time back in August after the job market made it apparent to me that I was already pidgeon-holed and would not be able to do something much different directly from my current job. So, I could either take another job as a transition to what I want to do, or go to b-school. At first I figured I would just apply as a backup but focus mainly on going for the transition job. That led me to only apply to what I considered my top choices- HBS, Stanford, and Wharton. But in the course of doing all these applications I've decided I really do want to go to b-school. I could really use a change of pace right now, and b-school seems to have the best mix of things.

Anyway, I took the GMAT in September, scored very well, and banged out the HBS and Wharton apps in the two and a half weeks that followed before the deadlines. I am lucky enough to work for a very accomodating company that allowed me the time necessary to get the apps done. That and I have a very knowledgeable friend at the U of C GSB who helped me brainstorm ideas for essays and edit them.

Once those two were out the door, I went to Chicago to visit my friend as well as some others. Since I knew I was going, I had already arranged to do an interview at the GSB. I didn't realize it was also the prospy weekend. The night before the interview, I went out to the GSB Thursday Night Drinking Club with my friend. I didn't really have that great a time and it reminded me of undergrad way too much (ie. not fun, but that's another story...). It was also freezing and only October! After that, I decided I wasn't going to apply, but I should do the interview anyway for practice. I went in, no prep or anything, and had at it. It was not out of arrogance that I did this but actually naivete about the preparation normally done for such interviews. Since then I've learned what needs to be done for an interview :). Luck was on my side though, and it went about as good as it could. I was not at all nervous because I already knew I didn't want to go there (there are better reasons than those I've listed, but they must remain hidden for anonymity purposes). At the end of the interview the interviewer said something like "If you tell anyone I'll deny it, but I'm telling you now you're getting in." I feel kind of bad now writing this as I'm sure there are plenty who think I'm an idiot or perhaps selfish for squandering this, but you'd understand if you knew my reasons. Oh well, maybe after I get in somewhere I'll reveal them. Look at it this way, at least I'm not taking a seat from someone else who does want to go.

Before that weekend, I went to a Stanford infomation session and I was amazed. I had actually been having some doubts that the school was right for me, but after the information session all concerns were allayed. It seemed like my ideal school. So, I really wanted to do a good job on the application. After I came back from Chicago I had about two weeks before the deadline. Unlike the other essays, Stanford Essay A needed over a week for me to do right. I think it's one of the best things I've ever written. But, it's very personal, doesn't even imply anything about leadership and all the other stuff adcom's look for, and so may not work. I knew it was a bit of a chance, but a chance I thought worth taking because I thought so well of it. I only hope the adcom does too, but we have yet to see...

Applications away, relief finally set in, but only until mid November when I decided to just check the message boards to see what, if anything, was going on. I found out it was already time for Wharton interviews, the deadline was approaching, and I had yet to receive an invitation. Panic set in, and so I scoured every inch of the message boards and discovered such things as the S2S board and blogs. Since then, I've been an active reader (and stresser).

Few days after I got my invitation to interview with Wharton. I decided to do a campus interview since I didn't want to be asked by an alumnus "Have you visited yet?" and have to reply "Uhhh, no, even though I'm only an hour and a half away, but I know really want to go there anyway...." That and I figured I'd do better with someone closer to my own age for the interview. Campus was great, people not at all like the stereotypes, and classes interesting and engaging. I'm sure you've all read other stuff about Wharton, so I'll leave it at that. The interview itself went ok. The interviewer, a second year girl in the healthcare program (forgot the name), grew up near where I did, and started out the interview saying it would be conversational. "Excellent," I thought. I walked her through my resume very casually, conversation flowed throughout, and before I knew it 45 minutes were up. Sounds like it went well, but at the end I was attempting to get some kind of subtle indication, only to find a completely neutral face. After getting such a clear response at U of C, that response did not sit well. And afterwards thinking about it all, I gave a mediocre reason for why MBA and Wharton and many of my attempts at humor did not seem to have the desired result. I might have scared her a little by mentioning my interest in philosophy too. Could have been better, could have been worse, I guess. Since then, I developed a theory that those kinds of interviews might be the worst kind. "Good" interviews are likely to be perceived as good by the interviewer. "Bad" interviews are most certainly not good, but I think adcoms might be forgiving if the application is good because they realize sometimes people just have a bad day and are willing to give them the benefit of the doubt. "Ok" interviews are neither good nor bad, but typically do not lead the interviewer to believe the interviewee was just having a bad day. The "ok" performance is likely to be viewed as what the person can offer, which is just ok. I'd love to hear some others' insights into this logic. Anyway, interview done I stuck around for Pub, had a great time, and realized Wharton was an excellent "fit" for me.

And that about sums it all up to date. No word from HBS nor Stanford. I have little hope for HBS because I don't think I fit there based on the admittedly little I know. I think I fit really well at Wharton and, based on the informational, Stanford. There's now about a day and a half before I find out about Wharton, but for some reason I'm not stressing about it much. Maybe it's a "calm before the storm" kind of thing. I am stressing most about getting an HBS interview for some reason. Perhaps it's because I have little hope of getting one and am in some kind of subconcious denial that I might not get an interview with Stanford because I think my application there was so much better than my others. Wharton I can do nothing about with so little time left. But I guess I can't do anything about HBS or Stanford either...?

Hope this has been interesting enough for you. If not, too bad.

My first blog entry

2004-12-17T14:51:00.000-05:00

This seemed like a really great idea based on all the others I've read, so I thought why not? Of course, I have nothing of note to say...